PaulS

Sorry, nothing from me. In fact, I don't even do Lent.

Welcome FireDragon, I don't think anybody here will compel you to accept the 8 Points to participate in the forum! Essentially, as long as we respect other people and their opinions, we can all enjoy a diverse and fruitful place to discuss our thoughts and views. I hope you enjoy it here and I look forward to your participation. Cheers Paul

Thanks for trying to sort that Joseph.

I'll let Joseph look into the RSS feed thing, but in the meantime Angel, if it's of any use, I use the 'View New Content' link at the top right of this page to see if there are any new posts/discussion threads which means I don't have to browse through the website. Hope that helps some.

You raise some good points, Angel. I personally, didn't interpret the farmer parable to be symbolic of a sort of 'don't care' attitude towards his circumstances like you suggest concerning the holocaust perhaps (i.e. sit back and do nothing). I imagined the farmer probably looked after his son with the broken arm (or was it a leg?) and perhaps corralled the wild horses that he had come into possession of. I think he took action, but simply recognised that those actions may or may not be a good or a bad thing (simplistically speaking). Yes, there could be a destructive temptation to repress feelings, but again for me, I didn't read that into it. Rather at a surface level I read that these events could be either fortuitous or not, maybe. But that doesn't negate carrying on with your life and taking action you think appropriate. "This is the terrible defect of every philosophy, religion or spirituality that pursues detachment, indifference, repression of manifestations of grief or rage." But doesn't Tibetan Buddhism for instance teach detachment whilst simultaneously having a spiritual leader/representative, the Dalai Lama, that very much has political views and opinions and encourages action rather than indifference? Personally, I think the detachment points to letting go of the pain and angst that comes with things not being as you would like them, but is far from saying don't do anything about them. I'm no Buddhist though so perhaps I am off the mark. I agree with your concerns for PC if it's understandings were intended as dogma (incidentally I think they are far from that), although I would go so far as to say ANY human organisation/collection of like minds seems to run that risk of being corrupted or being sold as THE only truth. We certainly see that with many religions, including fundamental Christianity, but also within Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism, etc. I think the purpose of PC is actually to move away from that paradigm of 'right belief' and encourage open-mindedness. Thanks for your thoughts. Cheers Paul

I like that too, Rom.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OX0OARBqBp0 I liked this parable. I wonder if anyone else would like to comment on it? Cheers Paul

"Often we wander off into the territory where god is transcendent, ie beyond all categories of thought. So any answer we come with as to the reason for population density of our galaxy is by definition unverifiable or meaningless". I agree it is unverifiable, but I wouldn't say it is meaningless. I think lots of advances have come from 'meaningless' speculation and chatter. Who knows when one may come upon a 'truth'?

In my experience to date it seems the scientists can provide a lot more evidence and logic to their understanding than new earthers can to theirs, but appreciating how important the NE's theory is to NE's is the key to understanding their fervent faith. To me, if the science of evolution has made some mistakes or incorrect assumptions, no big deal. But to a bible-believing new earther, any threat to their theory can rock their whole world. I mean if a being called God didn't physically mould Adam from dirt and Eve from Adam's rib, then the bible's integrity is threatened from the very outset (if you share that interpretation of biblical historicity). When your whole life is styled around a fundamental & literal understanding of the bible and Christianity, that is a serious threat.

At 72yrs Marcus still had so much more to contribute to a better understanding of Jesus and Christianity. Many of his books really helped me reconsider true Christianity in a new light. RIP Marcus.

Ricklee, Here's a thread I started previously concerning so-called prophecy of Jesus. You may find it interesting to learn that much of so-called prophecy is actually about other events which early Christianity used as tenuous links to provided Jesus (and his Way) with some credibility. Cheers Paul

Fantastic Joseph! Sounds like you're livin' the dream! Glad to hear it's worked out so well.

Is that a yawn or a smile Joseph?

Warming up for Australia Day celebrations on 26 Jan! https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10152933970203614&fref=nf

Would anybody like to venture an opinion concerning what would appear to be a lack of life on other planets (at least in this galaxy) and just why any God might like it that way? I raise this in the context that many here believe in God as 'source' and often consider God to 'be' love, so I was just wondering what your thoughts may be concerning our possible/most likely isolation on this little blue dot. Cheers Paul

Ricklee, Bible believer or not, your are welcome here. In fact, if you were a Muslim, Hindu or adherent of any other religion you would also be welcome. As long as all participants adhere to the Forum's code of conduct, then they are welcome. But this is a discussion forum, so your views or opinions may be discussed by others. You ask what if the Fundamentalist is right? Whilst I myself don't think that is a possibility, you are entitled to your opinion. But may I question a few of your assertions in the above: You say the Bible states over 4000 times that it is the word of God. I would challenge that. Nowhere in the bible does it state that the entire bible (as we have it today) is the word of God. Of course various authors in the various books that makes up the library of the bible do make such claims independently though. I'm sure the individual authors often felt that they were conveying God's intentions - even when they were condoning genocide, rape, slavery, patriarchy, and so on as God's wishes. Concerning any so called prophecies about Jesus made in the OT - have you ever considered that it is actually more logical to see that the various NT authors have represented Jesus as fulfilling prophecies by linking Jesus to various elements of the OT rather than him actually fulfilling prophecy? There is a rich tradition of biblical authors taking verses out of context and applying them to Jesus to fulfil their message. There is much research and material readily available that can show this to you. I'm happy for you that Jesus has meant something to you and your life. Many people also feel this way about Allah, Mohammed, Buddah, etc. They too have died for their beliefs so they must be right too? Of course you're entitled to ask that if the fundamentalist might be right and if so, then what? But I think the point that Anne raised was that if you don't believe in something, then you can't believe in it, even though you may still fear or be concerned about it. I'm sure that makes no sense to you, but having been in her shoes I know exactly how it feels. The beautiful thing though is that I know that if there is a God of love out there, he isn't going to be sending any of his children to eternal torment.

Thanks Joseph.

Cheers Rom. I'm not up on my Joseph Campbell so didn't realize the difference between his Christ-myth view and that of mythicists. Thanks. ...and yes, Bart can be all that bad! I like that he is so thorough and so unbiased in his work.

Hey Rom, I'm reading an excellent book at present by biblical scholar Bart Erhman (Did Jesus Exist?) who disposes of the mythicist view that Jesus didn't actually exist. His evidence for the existence of Jesus is compelling. That said, whilst the evidence for his existence is strong, Erhman points out that next to no evidence is available of him being regarded as a cosmic saviour by his followers in his day.

For me, the 'Liar, Lunatic or Lord' argument seems a bit simplistic and overlooks the many alternatives. Firstly, it's quite likely that Jesus didn't say or do many of the things attributed to him. With the earliest Gospels not being written until decades and decades after the death of Jesus, I think it's very likely that there has been some poetic licence taken in the time between the life of Jesus and the writing of these Gospels. I'm sure the writers had the best intentions in mind, but that doesn't make it right. Secondly, as Joseph points out above, the either/or logic used when considering this statement makes no sense. Jesus could just as easily have been 'Lord' (or Teacher/Master) to many, whilst still incorrectly holding an immediate apocalyptic view of the world. It is clear that Jesus believed the end of the world was nigh (despite a later addition in the NT to try and make up for this prophecy not coming true by trying to turn a day into a thousand years), but this apocalypse did not occur within the existing generation. Does that make Jesus crazy or did he simply, hold a strong belief in something which wasn't actually true? Similarly, I don't think fundamental Christians are 'crazy' for holding their beliefs, and many of them are wonderful people. So I don't have to decide one or the other. I think the most logical approach is to consider Jesus within the context of his time and in the spirit of which the people at the time would have received him. Also, consider the Bible in it's entirety and the contradictory statements concerning eternity in Hell (if you believe as Rick seems to above) - elsewhere in the Bible God declares that he will never abandon us and that he is everywhere. Clearly, going to a miserable eternal hell absent of God contradicts these statements But to cover biblical contradictions, philosophical arguments about Jesus' 'Godship', and biblical scholarship would require much more than I have room for here. There is a wealth of scholarly material concerning the bible and Jesus out there and it takes a person a long time to read and study these various works. Some may find it much easier and much more secure just to swallow what's preached at their pulpit without question, or to happily live in ignorance to the well-documented alternatives concerning an understanding of Christianity. My prayer would be that God will help them see the light and direct them toward a better understanding of Jesus, God, and the Kingdom of God - I think the world would be a better place for it.

Welcome Bingle, I wish I had known about progressive Christianity all those years ago when I abandoned my faith for similiar reasons you touch on - it might have saved me a lot of grief and angst. I'm glad you've found this forum and I look forward to your participation here. Cheers Paul

All healed now, thanks John. I kept the bike in the end, much to my wife's disdain! Today I'm off to play 18 holes at a nearby beachside course (The Cut Golf Course) which should be good - not for the golf (I'm a hacker) but for the views!

For me, I find Facebook a much shallower forum. It doesn't lend itself to in-depth discussion like people get to participate in here, but rather allows one to post a quick opinion or point and then move on. It's a bit like talk-back radio where "everyone wants to express an opinion that nobody else wants to hear". Also, having reviewed the PC Facebook page, I can't see how one would access the archives of topics that are available here on the Forum. There is such a library of information and topics discussed here that is simply not available on Facebook. Perhaps Facebook grows quicker because of the convenience, but I doubt it is anywhere near as fulfilling or informative as this Messageboard.

Welcome Starjazz, I hope you find some useful resources in the archives here - or start a new discussion yourself on any point. Cheers Paul

Angelo, But apart from evolution, do you believe that mankind inherited sin because a physical Adam ate of a fruit and thus condemned all of mankind to eternal separation from God? I'm guessing not.