Presidential Poll

[JosephM]

Vote your preference. Your vote is not made public ( it's anonymous) unless you desire to post a comment indicating who you voted for or why.

[romansh]

As a non USA resident I won't vote but not surprisingly perhaps I will express an opinion.

 

No way I would vote for any of the Republicans ... they have lost their way since the mid eighties. And the part that saddens me is they have dragged the Democrats to the right with them. I would likely vote Hilary, not because I agree with her ideals, it is simply that I think she would have a better chance moving the US's politics closer to the "centre" than Bernie.

 

Political Compass is an interesting site ... it gives a slightly left leaning view of things in my view, but it has an interesting questionnaire ... I typically score about -4, -4 on it. Here is the site's take on the primaries.

 

And here is the 2012 US election, or at least their viewpoint. And if we compare it to the 2008 election we can see Obama has been pulled way over during his first term.

Edited April 20, 2016 by romansh

[PaulS]

Also as a non-US resident, I too favour Hillary for much the same reasons as Rom. I dread what the US may become if Trump is elected.

[soma]

I would like to see Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders be the running mate to keep Hillary honest. I went to Korea when they were a very poor country and a Coup de tat happened which restricted Korea with fear. I watched for 11 years as fear handcuffed the population and their creativity. Now, the rolls have changed and the US is handcuffed with fear and hate. Korea seems happier, freer and more creative. It started when the opposition leader who was jailed became president after two Generals left office.

[tariki]

Being born and bred in the UK perhaps my preferences are really if no consequence. But I voted for Hilary Clinton.

 

At risk if controversy (!) the race for the White House makes me think back to an old Peanuts cartoon where Charlie Brown plays the "nations number one" hit song to Linus. After listening, Linus just says "the nations in bad shape". Well, every time I hear the words of Mr Trump and realise that many support him I think..........

[soma]

tariki your preference is important because the president of the United States needs to interact, respect and be respected around the world, otherwise negotiation will be a lost art and war will dominate.

[Burl]

God tends to pick unlikely vessels. I would not be at all surprised if Trump wins and does a decent job, but I'm voting for Dr. Stein based on honesty and brains.

[soma]

Trump can't control or govern his tweets much less a country. He wanted entertainers to be mainstay at his convention and they turned him down, even conservative Republican names. Therefore, B list got the call and they did it not for Trump, but to get back into the spot light. The opening prayer was a shock praying against his mental enemies.

[romansh]

God

tends to pick unlikely vessels.

 

Some divine vessels of the twentieth century:

 

Enver Pasha

Kim Il Sung

Ho Chi Minh

Pol Pot

Saddam Hussein

Yahya Khan

Hideki Tojo

Vladimir Lenin

Hirohito

Chiang Kai-shek

Adolf Hitler

Joseph Stalin

Mao Zedong

 

But then it could be argued we are all divine vessels except when we are not.

[Burl]

Some divine vessels of the twentieth century:

 

Enver Pasha

Kim Il Sung

Ho Chi Minh

Pol Pot

Saddam Hussein

Yahya Khan

Hideki Tojo

Vladimir Lenin

Hirohito

Chiang Kai-shek

Adolf Hitler

Joseph Stalin

Mao Zedong

 

But then it could be argued we are all divine vessels except when we are not.

My list of unlikely vessels would include Malcom X, JFK, and Gen. Wm. Smedley Butler. I do not consider anyone on your list to be divinely inspired. Edited July 24, 2016 by Burl

[romansh]

My list of unlikely vessels would include Malcom X, JFK, and Gen. Wm. Smedley Butler. I do not consider anyone on your list to be divinely inspired.

 

Do you mean inspired by the divine? Or they are some god's instrument?

 

If it is the latter ... then I would argue your any lists we make are equally arbitrary.

But then you missed the point I was trying to make .... which is summarized at the bottom of my previous post.

[Burl]

Your statement was not missed. It is illogical as it begs the question.

[romansh]

Your statement was not missed. It is illogical as it begs the question.

 

And what answer does it assume?

[SteveS55]

I would argue that Donald Trump is merely a reflection, or manifestation of an underlying current of authoritarian fascism in this country. This is not surprising since most of his supporters are white, middle class people of European descent, a culture, I would also argue, that historically seems to be partial to monarchs or fascist governance. This is borne out by the nationalistic, nativist regimes of the 1930's. So, there is nothing particularly new about the Trump phenomenon. In himself, there is no real substance, or transcendent qualities. He is merely a showman for the masses who espouses their private, dark desires.

 

So, on election day, I'm going to take this humble vessel and vote against this clown!

 

Steve

[Burl]

"A divine vessel is a divine vessel unless it is not a divine vessel". The statement is self-referential.

 

I'm sure you had a valid point in mind but that statement does not communicate it. If you don't pull Schrodinger's cat out of that box how can anyone know it actually exists?

[romansh]

In himself, there is no real substance, or transcendent qualities.

 

You make him sound of the immaterial ...

 

And there aspects of Trump that are transcendent ... in the sense of beyond all categories of thought.

Edited July 24, 2016 by romansh

[romansh]

"A divine vessel is a divine vessel unless it is not a divine vessel". The statement is self-referential.

 

I'm sure you had a valid point in mind but that statement does not communicate it. If you don't pull Schrodinger's cat out of that box how can anyone know it actually exists?

 

So how will we ever know whether Trump will ever be a divine vessel?

I suppose you will be able to tell me?

[SteveS55]

The only thing worse than religion is politics, and together they are a disaster! I just vote my preference, something I have been conditioned to do, just like the Trump supporters do. Our religious and political beliefs are our addictions. When someone tries to challenge them, or take them from us, we act exactly like addicts, and become irritable and discontent.

 

Steve

[Burl]

As I said, I'm voting for Dr. Stein. I reject both uniparty candidates.

 

But we can tell a good tree by its fruit. If Trump becomes a divine vessel the character change will be undeniable proof.

[romansh]

But we can tell a good tree by its fruit. If Trump becomes a divine vessel the character change will be undeniable proof.

 

So when you decree Trump (or anyone else) as divine that is undeniable proof?

[romansh]

The only thing worse than religion is politics, and together they are a disaster! I just vote my preference, something I have been conditioned to do, just like the Trump supporters do. Our religious and political beliefs are our addictions. When someone tries to challenge them, or take them from us, we act exactly like addicts, and become irritable and discontent.

 

Steve ... I tend to agree with you, but it is not just politics and religion that are addictions. Going to work is one (but I am planning on giving that one up), love, thought, ideas, gardening, pride, breathing, life itself can be seen as an addiction. Some can be seen as more fun than others. And even that is in the eye of the beholder.

[Burl]

So when you decree Trump (or anyone else) as divine that is undeniable proof?

"No good tree bears bad fruit, nor does a bad tree bear good fruit. Each tree is recognized by its own fruit. People do not pick figs from thornbushes, or grapes from briers. A good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and an evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For the mouth speaks what the heart is full of." Luke 6:43-45

 

Malcom X is the clearest example I listed. A virulent racist and second in command of a rich and powerful cult, he performed the hajj and was dumbstruck by the equality of men before God. He resigned from The Nation of Islam, converted to Islam and became a severe critic of Elijah Muhammad proclaiming the equality of men. He was assassinated by NoI because of his change of heart, and his life continues to draw an uncountable number of people to God

 

I submit this is undeniable proof Malcom X was transformed by the grace of God, and that he was utilized as a divine vessel. There is no other possible explanation.

[SteveS55]

Yes, Rom. I suppose anything that keeps us in the game and annoys us when it is taken from us can be seen as an addiction, at least the way I have defined it. But politics and religion are particularly nasty ones! They are very hard to overcome.. I'm also coming to the end of my work addiction, and wondering what I will replace it with.

 

Steve

[SteveS55]

"I submit this is undeniable proof Malcom X was transformed by the grace of God, and that he was utilized as a divine vessel. There is no other possible explanation." Really, Burl? That is the only possibility?

 

Steve

[romansh]

But politics and religion are particularly nasty ones! They are very hard to overcome.. I'm also coming to the end of my work addiction, and wondering what I will replace it with.

 

Steve

 

Yeah ... I can't say I am overly infected by those addictions. It's a game and we think we freely choose to participate.

 

For me the topic of "free will" is a far greater addiction ... but that is OK too. Just is.

 

I too am wondering what to replace work with, in my retirement. Addiction to enjoying myself perhaps? :-)

Edited July 24, 2016 by romansh