PaulS

I'm not arguing that any of your Presidents were peacemakers or that Trump is not any better than another - my reference was only in regard to Burl saying "Blessed are the peacemakers. No war with Russia. North Korea's disarmament will earn Trump a Nobel. The multiple wars in the mideast no longer include the US. I have never seen a first term president have such astounding success." So yes, he had a meeting with NK but that hasn't improved anything. So I don't see him getting brownie points for telling us he has done so much to improve things on that front when nothing has changed. Perhaps the US needed elements of Trump, but I think the trade-offs outweigh the good he might do. It doesn't surprise me that certain demographics support Trump. I know you're joking concerning your Village - of course they love Trump and I know you know that a poll held in another demographic would return exactly the opposite result. Trump plays to 'his' people and alienates those who disagree with him. I'm not sure you're accurate about Trump being more popular. I guess it may come down to which polling you consider. But there is a reason why the majority of the country disprove of his performance compared to approving it. What I mean about the middle east and conflict is that it has been a miserable situation for all involved. What the picture will be, it will be. Peace could well come about by nuking a few countries. Would that be a good result?

Unless he is paying porn stars hush money to keep quiet about his extra marital affairs! Character.

I don't understand the import to you of the article you referenced. Yes Trump was the 1st President to meet Jung (Obama never wanted to for good reason) and since then (a year and a half ago) nothing has improved in relations or bringing NK into our world. NK are the same threat level as pre-Trump meeting. The middle east has already ended poorly for all involved, irrespective of what develops from this latest conflict with Iran. It's not that Trump is to blame, it's just that he's not a peacemaker and he hasn't done anything significant to change the situation. You say 'personality', I might say 'character'. Whilst he does have some strengths, I think his character is poor and that's what betrays the Presidency of your nation, in my opinion. Undoubtedly there is bias in much reporting so I try to not take opinion too seriously, but fact checking does reveal a lot of lies and exaggeration by Trump which I think should be considered embarrassing for the Presidency. If you don't mind those things, well, it is your country. Polling seems to indicate that the majority of Americans don't approve of his performance (but admittedly polling can be off) and his ratings have changed very little since his term began. It doesn't seem like he's gotten the rest of the country on board and moving in his direction but rather, his 'people' are digging in and nobody else is joining the party. That said, elections don't necessarily elect the most popular person (as we well know with Trump never getting a simple majority) and for some of the reasons you mention there may be those who don't rate Trump but don't want perhaps a rabid democrat as President either. So for both of us, I don't think it should be a case of I told you so no matter how it falls - unless Trump performs outstandingly at the next election - then I would accept that the majority of America has lost it's mind! Views on Trump are a perfect example of perception and perspective at work!

No, it's only you guys that get the fake news - our media here are beyond reproach and would never sensationalize or misreport a story! 🙄

I think your view may be a little pessimistic in that you think 'your level' has no influence! You vote don't you? Politicians do respond to voter demands even before elections. A pessimistic view could drive one to ask more questions and demand more answers and thus ensure the picture being provided is accurate.

I don't think 'all' media is propaganda, that's just too convenient in my opinion, but I do think that 'a lot' of media can be. I'm not asking anyone to reveal state secrets about Iran here Burl and there is no active military campaign currently involving the US with Russia or North Korea. Of course, none of that stops your president from tweeting about Iran. He does love his wrath that guy!

Regarding NK, I actually meant 'as low as ever' so to be fair, I don't think Trump has made anything worse with them, just nothing better and indeed, nothing even coming close to a peace prize. Same for the mideast - yes, there may have been war there 'forever' but my point is, Trump is no Peacemaker and gets no credit for improving anything there in my opinion. Whilst it has been demonstrated that Russia interfered with and influenced your last Presidential election, I agree that it is my 'presumption' that 'because' of the advantages given to Trump by the Russians that he has then favoured Putin. But if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck... But I certainly agree with you - Trump is the most polarizing leader the US has ever had. He certainly doesn't seem interested in bringing your country together but rather he seems to give the finger to anybody that doesn't agree with him - your own people included. I just see it as a shame and a poor representation of what I think the US used to stand for.

Do you think you might need to revisit this, Burl? -No war with Russia (because Russia help him win elections) -North Korea ignoring disarmament and relations as low as they'v ever been. I reckon that Nobel might be out of Trump's reach at this stage. -As for the Mideast, indeed Trump abandoned Syria to their fortunes but you'd have to say minimal improvement (perhaps enhanced problems now) in Iraq & Iran.

Interesting article here discussing the shortcomings of both optimism and pessimism! https://liberationist.org/the-bright-and-dark-sides-of-optimism-and-pessimism/

In what I consider to be in the best interests of this TCPC Forum, as an Administrator I have locked this thread for the time being to allow everyone to cool off, consider their parts in this forum, and hopefully continue in other threads without the distraction of historical posts. If you feel there is something you require to post in this thread, please PM Admin who can post your comments for you, following review. Let's all try and give this Forum a great start in 2020!

It is well-intentioned, and I believe actioned and owned in my posts as well, both here: and here: I am aligned with Joseph on this issue of a fresh start for all in 2020. Anybody's comments that are deemed demeaning, character-questioning, insulting and the like, will result in suspension. I had given my own personal commitment in the above posts prior to Joseph's recent warning to all.

I like that too! Sage advice.

My 'indeed' refers to that whole paragraph of yours that I quoted, which you concluded with "Indeed it does work for me............". So 'indeed' it works for you that you think you have empirically defined love, as it does that you don't see the word 'opposite' coming up short, as also you see yourself being very specific. 'Indeed' that perception works for you. Indeed, my view works for me too, and I think we have done this discussion to death. You have your view on opposites, I have mine. As I mentioned in my 2020 - New Year's Resolutions post, I plan to argue/discuss a point no more than one or two posts and let the rest just 'be'. So this is me, letting this discussion 'be'. Peace & goodwill.

Which is why I haven't bothered with addressing each of your specific examples - I don't intend on dragging this out trying to convince you of otherwise, other than what I said - they are not 'opposites' but rather personal perceptions on the continuum of perspectives. You have stated your view, I have stated mine, life goes on. Indeed.

I wonder how people here view the killing of Iranian General Qasem Soleimani, PMF Deputy-head Abu Mahdi al-Muhandis, other members of the PMF, and possibly other collateral damage (people) carried out by the US in a drone strike on Iraqi soil on 3 Jan 2020? Clearly there is an argument from the US government that these killings were deserved and also prevented further harm to US citizens otherwise to be caused by these blokes. And there is a counter-argument from Iran that this was a terrorist act/act of war by the US, on a much-loved son of Iran. I'm not sure if we have any Quakers on here who I presume would generally be against any killing whether in war or otherwise, but how do others view this incident. Justified? Murder? Christian? Other? What say ye?

The fresh start of 2020, both as a new year and a new decade is an excellent opportunity for everybody to reconsider how they approach their posts and consider whether they could drop sarcasm or jibes or other words that simply don't contribute to the general spirit of community and respect, here on the TCPC Forum. I'm not without a plank in my own eye sometimes, but I also will try to moderate better to help myself and others ensure this is a respectful and even inviting, community.

Welcome and yes, I think this is a place where you can participate in thoughtful discussions. Also, there is a lot of material in the forum archives from many previous discussion. Just adding a comment to one of those can re-spark the conversation too, even if it is years old. Cheers Paul

Like I said, if two significantly different things can still be considered identical opposites to another thing, then I think you have created a new understanding of the word 'opposite', but if that's what works for you. Personally, I don't think there are opposites, in that it's much like as Joseph pointed out - those actions are just points on a continuum based on one's perception (or in your case, perspective). So for me, other than broadly speaking, there is no 'opposite' to 'love' and I doubt anybody can empirically define 'love' in all of it's various guises. One can be in opposition to something but I see that as different as defining an action as an 'opposite' to another action. More specifically, I think the word 'opposite' simply tries to help us relate an understanding but when one digs deeper into the word it really does come up short as to me, there actually are no true opposites. It's all perception/perspective. No, I see you as generalizing rather than being able to specifically capture an empirical 'opposite'. I don't see these as opposites but rather opinions based on perspective/perception. Indeed.

Personally we are not threatened at all where we live (I live about an hour south of Perth on the West Coast), but there is nothing but the fires on the news and in the paper', so it is all anybody is talking about. Our main supply line across the country has been cut off for a few days now so that may impact a little.

I'll take your permission to disagree as fine. To me you seem to have rendered the word 'opposite' meaningless in common discourse where you consider Hitler exterminating millions and millions and another person killing a single person, as both directly opposite to what you say Jesus was. It seems to me that everything then could be grouped into this so called 'opposite' of Jesus if you were also to consider adultery, lustful thoughts, anger, hypocrisy etc. It seems that any consideration for a continuum has gone out the window with there only being two ends and nothing in between (not sure what that would like as far as continuums go). So for me, you've made no meaningful distinction concerning 'opposite', but that is fine. It works for you.

I went on a once in a lifetime vacation a couple of years ago - Never again!

I'm taking a "“Shoot for the moon. Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars" approach!

Anybody here planning on making any New Years resolutions? Of course we don't need a special time of year and of course most resolutions fail within the first month, but is anybody else having a crack in 2020? I have several personal resolutions about things that are private (family & relationships mainly), but some of my less private ones include better personal financial management (I'm digging myself out of a huge global financial crisis hole and might not make it - financially speaking only), losing 20kgs in weight (I'm a solid built 6'2" guy who weighs 110kg), a fresh focus on my occupation now that certain threats have been removed (long story), and I would like to learn Indonesian as my wife and I love visiting there and would like to spend our years 1/2 there and 1/2 here in Australia in years to come (a fair way off at this point). Guitar and harmonica are on the list too but more as 'stretch' targets and I doubt they will eventuate One TCPC Forum-specific resolution is that I would like to start 2020 with a refreshed view of everybody participating here and leave behind past experiences. I plan to approach my posts in a different manner and to be more at peace when others have their view, even when I see it differently. I plan to argue/discuss a point no more than one or two posts and let the rest just 'be'. Maybe I will find myself asking more often "WWJD - What Would Joseph Do" as I value his approach and attitude and the private conversations we have had along the way. Thanks mate! . And you too Rom, I value your contributions and the questions you propose - they make me think. I find value in this forum and part of me suspects the hesitancy for others to get involved may be the certainty with which I and others often post. I imagine it can be daunting for some when really I feel this forum should be more an invitation, rather than a soapbox. So to that end I want to change how I post and respond. Hopefully you will all see a difference. Peace & goodwill to all (I mean that) and Happy 2020 to all. See you next year!

I can only tell you Thormas that I am not angry but to be honest I do sometimes feel frustration, as I perceive you to obfuscate and avoid subjects and try to duck around them when you may be at a point where you might have to acknowledge that the other has a point. That's my perception anyhow. I do have a good sense of humor but I just don't think your 'jokes' funny most of the time. In fact, I am skeptical you actually mean them as jokes but rather they seem to be little digs at other's views, but again, that's my perception. I have a bit on between now and 2020 and may not make it back here - so best wishes. I hope we can kick 2020 off with a clean slate and try to better appreciate and respect each other's opinions and points of view without judgement and presumptions of attitude. Peace and goodwill Thormas. Happy New Year.

I don't think it has been at all Thormas, but so be it.