AletheiaRivers

Wallis has been mentioned very often lately on this board. Also, as I have been going through older threads, his name keeps popping up. I'm starting to wonder if "someone" is trying to tell me something? I guess I better wander over to sojourners.com and see what's there. Aletheia

I've never understood why Christians we be drawn to be anything but Democrats. The egalitarian society as espoused by Jesus was certainly closer to a socialist (Democratic) ideal than it was to our modern day capatilism. Other than the abortion issue, what moral issue is associated with the Republican party and not the Democratic? That's not a rhetorical question. I'd really like to know. Being basically raised a JW, I didn't know the difference between a Democrat and a Republican until the year 2000 and I'm still learning. It's only in the last election thay my husband or I have ever voted. Most everything that the Democratic party platform stands for is what I understand Jesus to have stood for (outside of the abortion issue). And as was pointed out, most Democratic presidential nominees were not pro-abortion, so why choose a Republican candidate over a Democratic candidate that is not only pro-life, but also anti-war? So really, what is it about the Republican party that would attract Christians? Any ideas? Just curious. Aletheia

My DVD's are here! My DVD's are here! Whoo hoo! Whoo hoo! Whoo hoo! Me? Excited? Nah! Aletheia

I sat here and thought about that question for a long time. I played both sides of a debate team in my head. LOL. My conclusion? They don't have to be tolerant. No one has to be tolerant about any viewpoint that doesn't agree with theirs. I think my view is better than theirs. I think my beliefs are more right than theirs. But I tolerate their viewpoints because I used to think exactly like they do. 5 years ago, I would have absolutely, positively KNOWN that I was right and everyone else was wrong. Now I see that as hubris. IT'S ALL IN THE ATTITUDE. Knowing you are right about God certainly shuts down dialogue quickly. If my soul is at stake, I would think that tolerance on their part would be an important conversion tool. They can still "know" they are right and be tolerant. The thought patterns aren't mutually exclusive. But do they HAVE to be? No they don't. Aletheia

Matt 5:17-48 is Jesus discussing the Law, the Torah, and how the people understood it. Jesus says: "Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets; I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. ... For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and the Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven." He then goes on to discuss various commandments. He takes a commandment and says: "Here is what the letter of the law says." He then takes the same commandment and says: "Here is what the SPIRIT of the law is." Don't just "Not commit murder" but don't even hate or curse your fellowman. Don't just "Not commit adultery" but do't even lust in your heart. Don't just "Not swear falsely" but don't swear at all. Just let your yes be yes and your no be no. Don't just "Love your neighbor" but love and pray for your enemies as well. The scribes and the Pharasees had made the Torah a burden to the people. Jesus was saying basically "The Law isn't a burden at all. It can be 'summed up" in principles. Those principles are ..." Aletheia PS: As far as lust goes, I doubt Jesus meant the passing "Oh, she's cute." or "Oh, nice butt." Humans appreciate beauty in all forms. But LUSTING implies thinking about for a period of time, longing for, desiring after. Basically, it's the premeditative portion that comes before the action of adultery. Even if it doesn't lead to adultery it should show the person doing the lusting that something isn't quite right and that perhaps they should address what is going on in their marriage.

Des, It definitely is what you are thinking of. Like I said above, they have icons for "your country", icons for y"our faith", icons for "your gender", icons for "your guestbook", an icon to bless you, an icon to add to your reputation, plus about a half dozen more I think. Technicolor smiley vomit! They do have a gazillion forums, including liberal Christianity, "other" religions and philosophy. But the board is so horrible to look at, I couldn't stand even reading the posts. Aletheia

Brain control from the smileys. Hmmm. I wonder if it's a secret government plot? Is it Bush? Is it Cheney? Perhaps JibJab has the answer! http://www.jibjab.com/lowband/default.htm Aletheia

LOL! What a horrible forum! Garish. Toon-town. It's like a smiley icon threw-up! Or perhaps the icons "multiplied and filled" the forum when no one was looking? "Click here to bless this participant." "Click here to add to this participants reputation." No wonder it loads so slowly. Aletheia

I don't mind that you use the >>> to indicate quoted text. I'm used to boards that don't have the quote option. I use a lot of smiles in my posts. I have a "worry" that I come across in my posts as serious, egotistical, etc... I'm hoping that the smilies show that I don't intend my words to come across that way. Epilepsy huh? I've had siezures before, but that was because of a medication that I was on. The seizures were always brought on by blinking lights. They werent' fun at all. I'll try not to use the smilies that are animated. There are only a couple. Hey, back on topic: Did you guys read the penguin article. Too cute. Aletheia

Ooooohh Soma, seditious stuff! How could anybody be threatened by such a beautiful sentiment? It blows my mind! Aletheia

The DaVinci Code was an awesome book. I gave it to my dad for fathers day when it came out. He hated it, so I inherited it. I read it and loved it. I loaned it out and it is still out making the rounds. Just enough innuendo and mystery to make things seem plausible. But I would have to agree it's fiction. I am, however, getting a kick out of the knee-jerk reaction from a lot of conservative Christian writers. I can't believe how many books there are out there just to "prove" that the whole thing is a lie. And since the market is so glutted with "DaVinci disprovers", the writers are now writing books to disprove an earlier Dan Brown book called "Angels and Demons". It's not as good as DaVinci, but it's still fun. Maybe they'll try to disprove his other books next. LOL! Aletheia

The links are the classes that I bought. From Christ to Constantine on DVD and Early Christianities on DVD. I'm psyched! Aletheia

Gaston, I hear your frustration and anger and I sympathize. But- Perhaps you shouldn't judge or categorize all "fundamentalists" by those that you encountered at that web sight. Not all "fundamentalists" are the same in beliefs or personality. My mom is quite conservative and she doesn't cause "hatred or mischief" in America. Aletheia

Seeking As much as I hate giving my money to the huge book conglomerates, I equally hate giving my money to buy NEW books to any bookstore because it requires that more trees be chopped down. So, I compromise. I buy USED books (usually for 50-75% off) THRU amazon.com. I've sold many books, DVD's and CD's through them. I wasn't useing the books anymore, and someone else got a really good deal. What I can't sell, I donate to the library. Aletheia

Numinous? The chariot, the cherubim and the New Jeruselem as alien. LOL. That's funny! Awesome idea! I'll never read Revelation the same way again. Aletheia PS: I thought you said you were working on your "quoting skills"? PPS: Kidding! You know I'm kidding? Good!

Here is one love story that I particularly appreciate: http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c...MNG3N4RAV41.DTL New York -- Roy and Silo, two chinstrap penguins at the Central Park Zoo in Manhattan, are completely devoted to each other. For nearly six years now, they have been inseparable. They exhibit what in penguin parlance is called "ecstatic behavior": That is, they entwine their necks, they vocalize to each other, they have sex. Silo and Roy are, to anthropomorphize a bit, gay penguins. When offered female companionship, they have adamantly refused it. And the females aren't interested in them, either. At one time, the two seemed so desperate to incubate an egg together that they put a rock in their nest and sat on it, keeping it warm in the folds of their abdomens, said their chief keeper, Rob Gramzay. Finally, he gave them a fertile egg that needed care to hatch. Things went perfectly, and a chick, Tango, was born. For the next 2 1/2 months they raised Tango, keeping her warm and feeding her food from their beaks until she could go out into the world on her own. Gramzay is full of praise. "They did a great job," he said. Roy and Silo are hardly unusual. Indeed, scientists have found homosexual behavior throughout the animal world. The rest of the article is at the above link. I have a gay cockatiel for a pet. Aletheia

Anybody who likes Tron is great in my book. Did ya hear they are going to remake it? They better do it justice or heads will roll! Welcome to the forum. Glad to have you. Aletheia

I totally hear ya there. Reading and participating over at bnet I'm surprised at how many self described conservative Christians say something like: "I'm fundamentalist, but I don't believe Jesus was God or that homosexuality is a sin or that women can't be priests or that there is such a thing as hell ... etc ... etc ... etc ... " If someone mentions to them that they might not actually be "conservative" they don't like that at all. "Yes I am TOO conservative!" But I can understand the resistance to change. Change is definitely NOT easy. Aletheia

Hi Seeking! Great to have you here. Boy the board has acquired many new people in the past few days! Way too cool! Like Beach, I was a Jehovah's Witness. I wasn't raised as one though. I was baptized when I was 21 and left when when I was 31. Looking back I'd describe Jehovah's Witnesses as "Fundementalists." This is ironic because most fundamentalists wouldn't even consider JW's Christian because they are not trinitarian. JW's take the Bible literally and plainly (meaning they read the text and try to understand the "obvious" meaning). If the story is (to them) obviously a parable then they take it as a parable. Anyway... After I left JW's, over the course of about a year, I went from being a believer pretty much to being an atheist. But God kept "calling" and so I investigated Deism as a view of God's involvment in the universe. That led to Buddhism and Hinduism, but not seriously. Just dabbling. I investigated neo-paganism and found relating to God as "female" very wonderful. However, there is no adult or mature pagan community here and I'm deeply interested in community. During all of my investigations into all these faiths, I picked up various books on "alternative" Christianities including many already mentioned: The God We Never Knew by Marcus Borg Coming of the Cosmic Christ by Matt Fox God at 2000 edited by Marcus Borg Original Blessing by Matt Fox There is a Spiritual Solution to Every Problem by Wayne Dyer Thou Art That by Joseph Campbell The Heart of Christianity by Marcus Borg New Seeds of Contemplation by Thomas Merton All good books. I'd recommend "The God We Never Knew" first. My route has been all over the place to get where I am now and I feel like I'm finally home. In so many ways I've come full circle. I wouldn't trade the insight I've gained for anything. It's opened my eyes to other beliefs and most importantly, it's been a lot of fun! I think religion and spirituality should always make you THINK and maybe make you just the slightest bit uncomfortable with new ideas. Aletheia

http://www.teach12.com/ttc/assets/coursede...ptions/6577.asp http://www.teach12.com/ttc/assets/coursede...ptions/6593.asp On those! Aletheia

Hi Thom! So glad to have you on the forum. I feel like I know you since I've read so many of your posts over at UCC, although I only posted once there myself, in introduction to the board. Just don't tell any of the "crazies" from over there about this forum. Aletheia

I'm lucky to have escaped the sight ONLY spending that much. And to keep this cryptic exchage on topic with the thread: I'll share what I learn on this board and hopefully encourage discussion! Aletheia

"Meaningless" - Hebrew word is "hebel". Also translated as "Vanity". The word literally means "breath" or "vapor". In Ecclesiastes, it is used as a metaphor for things that cannot be grasped either physically or intellectually, things that are ephemeral, insubstantial, enigmatic or absurd. Elsewhere in the Bible, human-beings themselves are said to be "hebel". Aletheia

Pssst! That was Des, not me. Aletheia

PS: Thanks to you, I just spent $160.00.