Burl

I believe some of the miracles did occur, but one needs to look at each one individually and discuss them seperately from healings. Your question is too broad for a meaningful answer.

I like accurate reading. Most Christians do not know that most of what Jesus taught was paraphrased from the Torah and the Phophets. They don't know how much work it is to come up with a reasonably correct interpretation. My personal exegetical apparatus has almost 100 perspectives to consider. Still, sometimes people do simply open a Gideon's bible and are compelled to seek God. Never fails to amaze me.

If by 'over the top' you mean hyperbole we completely agree, but I think his thought points in the right direction.

On the subject of the importance of connection to your ancestors and your existence as a means to pass on spiritual values to future generations? The maintainence of the connections within this everlasting chain? What do you think TNH is getting at here? PS: You are blessed, dude. Deal with it

The combination of cement, sand and rock does some really great stuff. Even if it offends the mineral world. May God bless you.

This seems to be a dwindling topic. Why the universality of salvation in Christianity is not deemed more interesting by people who profess to follow Jesus is curious. I tend to think there is a general lack of education about Jesus and Scripture in general.

Precept 1: Aware of the suffering caused by the destruction of life, I vow to cultivate compassion and learn ways to protect the lives of people, animals, plants and minerals. I am determined not to kill, let others kill, and not to condone any act of killing in the world, in my thinking and in my way of life. My opinion is that this is hyperbole, a rhetorical technique Jesus often used. TNH himself admits it is an impossibility when he notes we cannot boil water or eat vegetables without killing life. The minerals part I'm not so sure about. Concrete seems to have a positive valence. Still, I think we must accept this as an ideal. Blessing every meal is an act of contrition as well as one of gratitude.

Chapter 7: For a Future to be Possible TNH writes of the importance of connecting with religious roots and reinvigorating faded or disconnected precepts. This lies at the heart of Progressive Christianity. It also is essential to the transmission of wisdom within contemporary society and the past, which Christians call the communion of the saints, and implies that without religious and communal involvement there may be no future. TNH rephrases each of the Five Wonderful Precepts of Buddhism. I suggest we take each precept individually.

Luke 15:1-10English Standard Version (ESV) The Parable of the Lost Sheep 15 Now the tax collectors and sinners were all drawing near to hear him. 2 And the Pharisees and the scribes grumbled, saying, “This man receives sinners and eats with them.” 3 So he told them this parable: 4 “What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he has lost one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the open country, and go after the one that is lost, until he finds it? 5 And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing. 6 And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and his neighbors, saying to them, ‘Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep that was lost.’ 7 Just so, I tell you, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who need no repentance. The Parable of the Lost Coin 8 “Or what woman, having ten silver coins,[a] if she loses one coin, does not light a lamp and sweep the house and seek diligently until she finds it? 9 And when she has found it, she calls together her friends and neighbors, saying, ‘Rejoice with me, for I have found the coin that I had lost.’ 10 Just so, I tell you, there is joy before the angels of God over one sinner who repents.”

Hi Lucas!

"Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him." James 1:12

Thank you, Soma. I feel like I'm getting to know you better. You're an ok guy.

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here, but it comes across as let's just dispense with critical thinking and reduce everything to the least common denominator.

Me too, but stretch your social legs a bit and move outside of your racial/historical/emotional comfort zone. You can do both. You will probably like Wednesday nights with Pentecostlists better. It's more informal. Pentecostalism is the fastest growing sector of Christianity, especially in the non-US world. Now that you are relocated, take advantage and stretch out a bit. Don't abandon what you know, but open yourself up to new ways of approaching God.

No, there are no arbitrary points. Righteousness is not relative. In Christianity sin is anything which makes it difficult for the Holy Spirit to abide. Sin is a natural part of life one needs to deal with. We shower regularly and brush our teeth. It's a practice of personal hygiene. If we miss a day our teeth don't fall out and we don't break out in boils. If we pretend personal hygiene is arbitrary, and many do, first people start to avoid us and then health problems eventually set in. The practice of maintaining personal holiness is the same. Sin naturally occurs as a byproduct of life and we remove it by the practice of repentance and forgiveness. One cares for the cleanliness of the soul the same way one cares cleanliness of the body. Sin is spiritual poop. Yes, it is natural but please don't tell me refusing to wipe yourself is arbitrary

Soma, since you are interested in direct experience I wondered if you have spent much time in Pentacostal churches? I lived in New Orleans for a couple decades and have spent a lot of time with authentic tongue talkers and people who were slain in spirit. I also attended several Voudou services but always felt like an outsider there. My conclusion is that there is definitely something happening there.

+1

>>I would argue the original sin is seeing the world in terms of good and evil is the "sin".<< Weren't you just insisting on the reality of evil the other day?

Matthew was written around 70 A.D. It was based on redacted oral history (note it is according to Matthew; Matthew was not the author) and an unknown text referred to as "Q". Q has never been found, but is inferred from the commonalities in Matthew, Mark and Luke/Acts. I think it's a fair statement to say that these three gospels are the best record we have of first century Christian belief.

Hi CA. You are trying to paint truths with a 3" flat brush when you need a pointed sable. The Hebrew word torah translated as 'law' is not quite like our English word 'law' and there is ceremonial law, civil law, religious law, a holiness code etc. Add to that in Christianity Jesus was correcting the overly literal implementation of the torah adopted by the Jewish community. The best place to start your study of Jesus' teaching of the torah is Matthew 22:36-40. "36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” 37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.” That is the Christian litmus test for righteousness.

Original sin is nothing more than egoism. People are universally born thinking they are the center of the universe and ignorant of God. Christianity can correct this, but it's not the only way. Embracing interbeing or the shahada serve the same purpose.

Note that lectionary readings are part of the Progressive Christianity home page every week. I am attempting to draw the discussion board closer to its home. Point one of the eight points is most relevant: have we even read the teachings and example of Jesus? My questions on this weeks reading: 1) Jesus has a large number of followers, but he gives them an unattractive message. Why? 2) The phrase 'pick up the cross and follow me' is used before the crucifixion is in view, so it must have meaning unrelated to Calvary. What could it be? 3) Jesus' rhetoric is that both parables support his conclusion in Luke 14:33, but this is baffling. What is the relationship?

Wow. You have pretty negative stereotype of Christianity built up there. I have seen a bit of that, but only in independent churches. I have been visiting a different church every week and almost never hear sin mentioned at all. Too many pastors more interested in people pleasing than in genuine spiritual leadership. My complaint is that it is generally difficult to even find Christianity in many so-called Christian churches. Lots of lame praise songs with mayonnaise lyrics and sermons full of pop psychology. I was in a United Church of Christ a couple weeks where Jesus was only mentioned once incidentally in a prayer and the sermon was on the wisdom of Yogi Berra. I don't think Jesus came to help us with everyday problems. In fact, he warned us that following him would make our everyday problems worse. He did not condemn everyday people for sin, but he did sharply criticize the shallowness of the Pharisees misuse of the law and pointed towards it's true spiritual goal. Pick one of those sweeping generalizations and we can discuss it. A direct question: Please describe the last time you attended a Christian worship service using the journalistic 5 W's.

Luke 14:25-33 14:25 Now large crowds were traveling with him; and he turned and said to them, 14:26 "Whoever comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and even life itself, cannot be my disciple. 14:27 Whoever does not carry the cross and follow me cannot be my disciple. 14:28 For which of you, intending to build a tower, does not first sit down and estimate the cost, to see whether he has enough to complete it? 14:29 Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it will begin to ridicule him, 14:30 saying, 'This fellow began to build and was not able to finish.' 14:31 Or what king, going out to wage war against another king, will not sit down first and consider whether he is able with ten thousand to oppose the one who comes against him with twenty thousand? 14:32 If he cannot, then, while the other is still far away, he sends a delegation and asks for the terms of peace. 14:33 So therefore, none of you can become my disciple if you do not give up all your possessions.