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grampawombat last won the day on July 1 2011

grampawombat had the most liked content!

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About grampawombat

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    Seattle, WA
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    history, sociology (especially the sociology of religion), ethics, theology (especially liberation theology and process theology), social and economic justice, peace
  1. You might take a look at With or Without God by Gretta Vosper for ideas. I think she is a minister in the United Church of Canada.
  2. Hi Pete, I agree with you regarding the parts in red, but I have additional reservations. First, I'm not so sure about words like maker or creator. And I think there should be some additional words between "Mary" and "suffered." I agree that Jesus went somewhere, but I don't know whether or not "heaven" is sufficient. I can pretty much go along with the rest, though, and I particularly like the idea of "The Communion of Saints." To me it means all those in whom Jesus is seen to be "risen" by their commitment to peace and justice. There is a statement of faith from the United Church of Can
  3. I can't say I know where I stand, so I offer some comments on how I got to be a TCPC member. Ten years ago last May I joined Beliefnet. I enjoyed participating in it for several years, especially on the science and religion board, the progressive Christianity boards, and in various discussion groups. But occasionally I would look around for something else, and in December 2004 I also joined TCPC. Mostly I stuck with B'net, as there wasn't much going on here that was of interest to me. A few years ago B'net was purchased by the Murdoch empire, and became less interesting. Maybe that is just a
  4. Hi Myron, About 25 years ago I took a class on Whitehead's Process and Reality (P&R). We used A Key to Whitehead's Process and Reality, edited by Donald W. Sherburne (1966, U. of Chicago Press). In that class, I wrote a paper incorporating some process ideas with liberation theology. In the paper I cited two liberation theologians, Schubert Ogden and Delwin Brown. Maybe looking at some of their publications would help to see the relationship between progressives and process folks. I get a somewhat different slant on P&R than what you have described. In that regard, I would rec
  5. I just finished God and Sex by Michael Coogan. It was published last year. In it, I think he comments on all of the topics discussed on this thread. One of those is the Romans 1 passage that many claim "proves" that homosexuality is condemned by God. Coogan makes many of the same observations that Spong made in The Sins of Scripture to refute this claim. As to talk vs. action: The Presbyterian Church USA has now made it possible for LGBT candidates for the ministry to be ordained. In that, it joins various Congregational, Lutheran, and Episcopal denominations. Because of the emphasis on pa
  6. Mars Attacks--what can be better than Slim Whitman music causing brains to explode?
  7. Today, the PCUSA(the denomination I belong to) made it possible for LGBT candidates for the ministry to be ordained. For 37 years I have been a very small part of the effort that brought this about. I can't say I am proud, because, after all, pride is a sin, so I have heard. But I'm awfully pleased.
  8. For a long time I have had the impression that the author of Revelation was writing for a people who were experiencing severe persecution, and intended to help them endure their trials. So the emphasis being on the idea that in the end the bad guys will get theirs is consistent with that. But it also makes sense that the author might eventually turn to a vision similar to Isaiah's peaceable kingdom.
  9. There is a lot in the whole incident that I continue to try to sort out. When the story first broke, I had the impression that bin Laden died during an exchange of fire. Now it seems more likely that this was not the case. Perhaps the person who shot him would have us believe that he appeared to be going for a weapon of some sort. Another possibility is that someone else in the area fired and bin Laden died as the result of returned fire. There was a quote to the effect that the Seals were prepared to take him alive if the occasion presented itself. So it is difficult for me to know whether or
  10. You might try Parkview or Westminster Presbyterian; Parkside or Pioneer UCC; or Centennial, St. Mark, or St Andrew Methodist. They are all in Sacramento.
  11. Well, I just got through identifying myself as a "Jesusian," so maybe I'm not. On the other hand, I have been an active lay member of one Protestant congregation or another for almost 50 years, and my brothers and sisters mostly call themselves Christians. So if I didn't, I would feel that I'm not taking them or their convictions as seriously as I should. And as I have said many times, "go figure."
  12. I generally use Jesus, and I suppose, given my convictions, should probably be called a "Jesusian" rather than a Christian. W Philosophically, words like Christ, Lord, and Savior tend to elicit a less than positive response in me. On the other hand, there have been so many people through history who do use those words, and whose actions in response to whatever they believe about them has demonstrated such a commitment to peace and justice, that I feel compelled to take them and the words very seriously. So I can live with the word Christ, but don't use it much.
  13. Maybe this is a case of "loving the sinner and hating the sin." After all, there are evangelicals, such as the Sojurners Community, with whom I share almost all of my social convictions. And there are others whose convictions could be called fundamentalist (at least in the early 20th century sense of the term) who ardently support such organizations as Habitat for Humanity. It is when people use their convictions, whatever they are, to act in ways that I find harmful that I get distressed. For example, this fellow Phelps (I think that is his name) from Kansas, who pickets funerals of slain
  14. Kath asks, "Why even quote the bible when we as 'progressives' know that what you quote is probably and most likely not accurate?" I realize that, for many, quoting the Bible has to do with citing facts to back up one's position. However, I find it more useful to think of the Bible as a vehicle for dialogue. In other words, in the Bible we have a document that we take seriously, and that provides us with stories and metaphors that we can use to illustrate aspects of a position. It is common ground and can therefore give us images to share. I think of the Bible as "a set of documents that d
  15. The first of the eight points states that progressive Christians are those who have found an approach to God through the life and teachings of Jesus. I have the impression from the discussion so far that this statement is not sufficiently restrictive. Is that the case? Now I have been an active Protestant church person almost all of my adult life, serving on various boards and being involved in my denomination at the local, regional, and on one occasion, national level. I also spent about ten years studying the sociology of religion at San Jose State and the Graduate Theological Union. I w
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