Burl

Here is one thing I am trying to solve. Why was mankind the only species to develop literature, architecture, science, religion, sculpture and the electric guitar?

I agree that the bible is not a simple book, so we must read all of it carefully and prayerfully especially when it seems difficult. Your topic is Genesis and evolution, but you are avoiding my question. How do you explain the two different creation stories in Genesis?

Piriripi, how do you reconcile the creation myths in Genesis 1 & 2? In Genesis 1 man and woman are created together after the creation of plants and animals. In Genesis 2, man is created first and then plants were created. God then created animals in an attempt to make a mate for Adam and failed, so Eve was made out of his rib.

1) Yes it is my post. I tried to fix it but couldn’t. 2) Natural selection is not a correct solution. The negligible and exceptionally rare occurrences of ring species Joseph mentions are exceptionally thin evidences. They really sounds more like variation within a species resulting in accompanying damage to reproductive capacity. Isn’t natural selection the precise reason the reason for the dominance of Western civilization? They had a bible but didn’t use it. As Linacre told Henry VIII, “Either these are not the gospels or we are not Christians.”

2 hours ago, PaulS said: I have only a passing interest in speculating if God created man by using evolution. I am not an anthropologist and 200k years is a terribly long time ago. I am interested in the bible as one of our oldest literary creations and the cornerstone of our civilization. I want to read it as accurately and as deeply as possible and try to determine what information those people who lived only 5k years ago intended to be preserved and passed on to me. That is something I can confidently achieve. How should I treat others? How can I maintain and increase a conscious connection with God? What pleasures seem attractive but turn into vices and lead into degeneracy and desperation? How can I uplift others? How can I live fulfilled & content, and how can I face death without fear? Those are some of my interests, and natural selection does not provide a source of inspiration. Or - if it might - how? What inspiration do you draw from that well? The Hammer of Freedom

I guess we will just have to leave this here then.

Evidently you did not go to the links.

Link to American Scientific Affiliation, a group involved in reconciling science and Christianity. https://network.asa3.org There is an interesting testimony by their magazine editor in the current CT (free). https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2020/march/sy-garte-science-answers-inconvenient-questions.html?utm_source=ctweekly-html&utm_medium=Newsletter&utm_term=4371187&utm_content=698410371&utm_campaign=email

Thank you, Joseph. I did not know that.

An Australian who thinks barbecued sheep is a nasty tradition? Heresy! That’s good Tucker, Mate! 🤗 I know of zero scientific evidence for any species ever evolving from another species. Perhaps you know of an example where this has been scientifically proven? It doesn’t offend me that you feel my need for religion is a nasty tradition, but this forum is organized around spiritual evolution, particularly as taught by Jesus, so you need to expect my interest here to lean in that direction. Jesus is pretty much my viewpoint for the entirety of existence. I respect your belief in scientism. If you could deepen my understanding of your spiritual path that would be great.

Paul, discarding our personal human tendencies and replacing them with the mind of Christ is the essence of salvation.

I firmly believe that there is a spiritual, non-material component to the species Homo sapiens. Yes, natural selection is a fact within species that can interbreed but that is absolutely not God. Natural selection is purely selfish. It is the law of tooth and claw, not mercy and compassion. It is eugenics, genocide and the biological selection of a master race. All of these were justified by evolution, but they are very distant from God. Morally, we need to examine our spiritual purpose and weigh the righteousness of our actions. The bible helps us do that. Natural selection does not.

God bless you, Piriripi. I admire your faith and I am glad to know you. I post on a phone so I rarely write long missives or cover more than a single point so feel free to follow up. The two different stories of Adam and Eve in Genesis are interesting to me for contemporary and non-historical reasons. The biggest is why did God create Adam? God has already created angels and other elohim, but he then creates an entirely different being out of physical clay. This baffles me, and it is the single most important question posed by the creation of mankind. Why are we here? What does God want from us?

You quote the PC.org homepage as the leaven of the Pharisees. I don’t believe that was the intention of the authors. No one has the answers, but some of us can indeed use the bible and the teachings and life of Jesus to point towards the truth as it is being revealed to us. What we all share are intelligent and heartfelt questions, care and concern for others, and the use of the role model and teachings of Jesus as a means of exploration.

John Belushi kissing Pope John Paul’s ring on the set of The Blues Brothers.

Well said.

Yes and no. Darwin’s theory of natural selection is useful in understanding why species become extinct, and how varieties develop. It is very useful in animal husbandry and agriculture. This, like all good science, is simply observing God in action. Natural selection is not particularly useful in understanding biology above the species level where organisms cannot reproduce. It is also not particularly useful in explaining the emergence of new biological structures. You are correct that the overgeneralization and backward extrapolation of natural selection into the pseudoscience improperly called evolution today is an error. It is like saying one can feed sausage through the meat grinder backwards to produce pigs. Piriripi, your post fails on both logical and biblical grounds. Note that Peter states: “But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.” (2 Pet. 3:8).

Paul, I said nothing about God. Your antipathy towards Jesus and his teachings is showing again.

Because it advertises itself as Christianity, so there is a need to stand up and speak out for Jesus just in case someone stumbles across the threshold.

Kinda sad, really. There is a potential for real mission work here, but you sound like a cemetery director. I keep thinking about that discussion with the lesbians about the antitheses. No other Christian forum I know of could host an intelligent conversation like that one. What happened to Piriripi? I tried to mail him and was told he cannot be mailed.

My reason was I invited the Progressive Christianity.org Facebook group as well as the Episcopal priest who directs this mission (and the other PC.org leadership) to participate in the forum. I thought it best to have something active when they logged in, but unfortunately it seems nobody in Progressive Christianity.org wishes to participate. Why do you think our active membership and participation have dwindled down to three active members and two administrators? We are like Samson depilated.

Wikipedia is useful for thumbnail overviews and for the references. I’m always open to change, especially new ways to lead people to center their lives around Jesus Christ. That’s why I like progressivechristianity.org

We are just guessing, Paul. Very few Christians care much about theology. Look at how few people read these days. General cultural trends are probably more of an influence than anything else

Wishful, inverted thinking. The decline in Christian church attendance numbers follows Western churches adopting progressive theologies. The mainline churches have all adopted progressive theologies and the are the ones measured by Pew and dropping in membership. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_population_growth shows the growth is in third world countries where Pentacostal/charismatic churches are flourishing. If Jesus is divine one needs to be a Christian. If one does not think so, they get eventually drop their faith and focus on involvement in a charity, politics or just stay home and wallow in their imagination.

I was hoping people would read Judges 13-16 and contribute a bit. Most folks have heard of Samson but few have really read the full story and it’s a darn good one. Fun fact: Samson dies destroying the Philistine temple of Dogon. There is a African tribe called the Dogon who believe their ancestors came from a particular double star system in Orion. It was not until modern times that this particular star was proven to be not a single star but a double star system.