Pete

There are other voices:- http://www.uuchristian.org/S_Who2.html

Bill,

 

I think it would be a good idea if you read Wiki and a few UU church sites a little more carefully.. While they are inclusive of all religions, (pluralistic as is Progressive Christianity) including atheists there is still approximately 20% who identify as Christians within many UU churches. Individuals may or may not self-identify as Christians or subscribe to Christian beliefs in a UU church same as here on this PC site. While the UU has expanded beyond the traditional Christian understanding i believe it would be unfair to label their church for them. In fact some UU churches still identify themselves as Christian Churches. In UU churches there are mention of God, Jesus, Buddha and other teachers. One week might be a lesson from Hinduism another week a Christian message etc. The reason i know this is my brother is a member and actually is allowed to participate in the way of sermons and he uses the teachings of Jesus and others quite regularly.

 

Secondly, if one truly loves others then in essence one is loving God. Isn't it harder to love your brother that you can see than to love God which you cannot see? Who among us can define God accurately other than sensing God's presence in another or oneself? Does the three letters of the word God speak louder than love? You yourself have said God is Love. if this is true than anyone who knows Love, even if the word God is never spoken knows God, Yes?

 

Joseph

Joseph I love that statement.

If love is from God and an atheist believes in love but not the concept of God are they still not moved by the same spirit of love even if they do not recognise it in the same way another does?

1 John 4:7-8. "⁷ Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. ⁸ Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.".

There are atheists and Christians in the Quaker meeting I attend and during the meeting I would place a wager that no one could recognise who was Christain and who was atheist. If there is love among us is this not how it is. Love does not build walls (IMO).

My point is that there's lots of people who claim they believe in the god of the bible and that they're Christians yet they ignore the teachings of Jesus and use the bible to justify violence and hatred and discrimination of minorities. On the other hand, there are lots of atheists who act more Christ-like than most Christians do. Many Christians would say being gay and being Christian is incompatible with each other, so should gays also be excluded from Christianity? If you allow gays to be Christians, why not atheists when almost every other major religion in the world has atheistic sects? Why should what people believe be more important than how people treat each other?

I personally have no issue with your view NG. I have read that although Bishop Spong does not call himself an atheist, he does not call himself a theist either. I think there is room for us all. However, I think with respect it does not really matter what I think. It matters what you think. Only you know what makes sense to you.

I recently served as pastor in a Ucc church and we hung on our outside wall a banner which stated, "We believe God loves all people. ( a rainbow flag was placed under the statement.) In the two years that I worked there, I received over 100 calls from people. Most of the callers asked questions like: if you believe God accepts gay people do you think God accepts me; I am divorce? or me; I am working with out a green card? or the most moving was a man who called and asked if we believe God accepted him, he was dying from cancer. I am so use to living in a community of acceptance, that I could hardly believe these folks had not heard the message of love and acceptance from a Christian church. The message of removing "literal-ism" from the Bible and shouting it from the roof tops acceptance must be told, people are waiting to hear. One gay couple asked me just before their wedding, "can we really stand at the altar to exchange our vows?" Again, I was happy to say YES! If any one knows of people in the Seattle area that are brainstorming how to spread this message, I would love to dialogue with them. Thanks, Linda

Welcome Linda. I found that inspiring. Thank you..

I find the term difficult. If we say Jesus was the Christ which I understand is Greek for the Messiah or annointed one. If we say we are Christian and believe that then are we not also saying we accept the OT concept of what an annointed or messiah means. The word Christian has many complexities and its modern sense is often different from the original sense as understood by the bible (IMO).

I do not know how much of what is said to be Jesus' words were actually his words. Does recognising some of the teachings of Jesus to be a profound influence on ones life make one a follower of Jesus and therefore a Christian in a modern sense? I really cannot say.

Define God for me and I will tell you if I also believe in that personal concept.

Do I believe in a God that hardened the heart of Pharoah or drowned everyone in the world except a few or destroyed cities just because a survey was not completed right? I would have to say no but there is something in the spirit of love that I believe to be bigger than us all and worthy of note and respect. I feel able to call that God and I am happy to believe that is God at work. Does that make me a Theist or an Atheist? I guess it depends upon the definition.

I have a few differing versions. I mostly use the NIV but then again I do not believe the bible is scripture and I feel free to disagree with some of the concepts. For me real scripture is written on the heart of each person and not on the collected works of others written so many years ago. Sure there are lessons to be had there. Lessons are to help a person learn (IMO). Dogma and dictating to another that they should accept all that is written does not aid learning for oneself in my understanding. That said, I have purchased another bible as the access bible does look interesting to me. Thanks for the pointer. What sold it to me was the footnotes.

Hi Jen,

I think you have found the right place. Welcome. I liked your introduction. Nerds and questioners who do not like attacking people as fundamentalists do sounds great to me.

Welcome friend.

Welcome Eclectic. I think there are many things you can teach us too. I am glad you have joined us.

Hi Nino. For me, Christianity is based on the belief of principles said to be set out by Jesus. The idea of having to swallow the whole, Paul, or the bible and to not to question things is in my opinion not a requirement. I believe we progress in the leadings of the Spirit and modern understandings. I do not allow conservative opinions to dictate my Christianity or hold the only definition of it. I see nothing wrong with you holding your own definition of what you believe and recognise it as just as valid. Welcome friend.

Hi! I am John, I am in my early 40s and I live in the UK. After years of being a conservative Christian, I now class myself as a liberal. I attend an Anglican church and am also gay. Er... that's it!

Welcome John. I am proud that you have joined us. I am also from the UK too. Bristol in fact. It is good to hear of people this side of the pond as well as the other side as it gives me hope. It is good to hear from you and I look forward to hearing more.

I know that the evoluntionary tree is more seen as evoluntionary mesh nowadays, with sideways movement as well as growth along branches, but Darwin did try to base his work in science and evidence he could find.

I hear there is an Evangelical school in the US that is teaching children that Darwin was wrong because they can prove that Dinosaurs lived at the same time as man.

They are using the mythical loch Ness monster "Nessy" from Scotland to prove it. Now there is no scientific proof that Nessy ever existed and there are a number of photos which have been declared as a hoaxes but to all it is seen as just a good local joke. Nessy has been good for the Scottish tourist industry and has sold a lot of post cards but little else.

see:- http://www.parentdish.co.uk/2012/06/25/loch-ness-monster-american-school-children-told-is-real/?icid=maing-grid7|uk|dl6|sec1_lnk3%26pLid%3D114614

All I can say is how desperate must they be to use Nessy as evidence to back their theory of creation and I question how reliable such teaching at the school can be.

Hi Soma, thanks for that, really interesting and a lot there for me to think about.

 

Hi TheNewMe12, yes I was at 1, not sure where I'm at now. Must check Marcus Borg.

 

Hi Pete, thanks for welcome and happy birthday. Hard luck last night, I was hoping England would win, cruel way to lose. Though I'm sure you agree that Italy were better.

 

Jim

Thanks you Jim.

I do not follow football or watch sport much. However, I guess I have one sporting weakness. When Ireland plays Rugby and I will be glued to the box

I am married a Dubliner and I would be in trouble if I was cheering for anyone else.

Hi Jim, Welcome to the forum. It is good to hear from you and that you have joined us.

Pete.

Welcome Luttrellcreek,

It is great to hear from you. I hope you find what your looking for here. We are proud to share our spring with you. Bless you friend,

Pete

Welcome Jody, It is great that you have joined us. I am sorry about your experiences with fundamentalist's but all I can say is their loss and our gain. Bless you and welcome friend.

Pete

Welcome Brian. It is good to hear from you. These lessons sound interesting. Do tell us more. I look forward to your posts.

It sounds like you have travelled a tough road my friend. It is a pleasure to have you join us. Can I explain God to the satisfaction of everyone or even myself? I do not think so but I still believe God exists, if many times beyond my understanding. I believe God loves us just the same. Welcome friend.

Hi Deb, it sounds to me your growing just fine. Because they do not promote this information in many churches there are those like me who saw the light after many years of wondering based on something just does not feel right. However, we got there in the end.

Welcome friend. It is great you have joined us.

Hi Hugo. I find when love is your religion, beliefs are often a secondary issue. Welcome friend.

Welcome Ramansh. It is good to hear form you. It is funny when I go to a Quaker meeting. There are people of all persuations in the meeting and yet it is hard to tell who is who in the meeting and I am not sure it matters. Labels are often not clear descriptions of people. It is good to hear from you.

Hi RA. We welcome questions here and your answers to ours too. Welcome friend.

Welcome Bea. There is no need to be nervous. We have all had similar journeys. God is not scripture and God is not a church or a set of Dogma and yet God is felt within where ever you are. your not alone. It is good to hear form you. Please stay a while and you will note we are not scary. We I may be first thing in the morning when I look in the mirror but that is another story.

Welcome George and Annette. Make yourself at home. Bless you both.

Welcome M Wolf. Good to hear from you.