October's Autumn Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 Here are some questions to help: Can you be a fundamentalist or conservative and be progressive? What about Orthodox? Do you have to be a Christian or come out of a Christian background? What beliefs can you or can't you hold? This is intended more of a place for people to post their ideas, not for debate or really discussion -- ask questions to clairify others ideas but not challenge them. I think it will be interesting to see how we all approach the idea of being Progressive or why we call ourselves that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
des Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 Well I don't think you can be a conservative *Christian* and a progressive one at the same time. Aren't they opposites? I think conservatives believe in a more literal reading of the Bible and of Biblical events (ie the resurrection). OTOH, you could be conservative in your view of Christianity and progressive socially, for example, some conservatives now believe in a faith based stand on global warming. That's pretty progressive. OTOH, I don't believe there are a set of beliefs marking one as essentially progressive or conservative. I think progressives tend to have a more personal view of their religious beliefs, but even that was once part of the Baptists. If anybody wanted to say they were progressive, I think I was say whatever they wanted to say or think about themselves. I might wonder personally but think it is their business. --des Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 Can someone be theologically fundamentalist or theologically conservative and be theologically progressive? I'd say no. However, any given progressive Christian might hold particular theological views that are considered conservative (like the virgin birth, for example). Can someone be theologically Orthodox and be theologically progressive? It depends on what is meant by "orthodox" - big or little "O"? Eastern Orthodoxy is very different than western Protestantism. They don't believe Adam was created "perfect" in the Protestant sense. They don't believe in original sin or the fall in the same way most western Christians do. They have a very different view of "atonement" and do not believe God demanded or was appeased by the sacrifice of his son. They view scripture much more metaphorically than western Christians. In many ways, if someone was describing their faith and never used the label "Eastern Orthodox," that person might be labeled progressive. Does someone have to be a Christian to be progressive? No. Someone could be a progressive Jew or Buddhist or Hindu or Muslim. I imagine there are bulletin boards for those progressive viewpoints. TCPC is a Christian one. What beliefs can a person hold or not hold? I really couldn't say. It's too broad a category - "beliefs." There are many shades of theologically progressive Christians. Not all are "historical Jesus, Jesus Seminar" types. Some lean towards "new age" viewpoints. Some lean towards pluralism. Some lean towards inclusivism. The deep truths found in scripture are amazing. I feel too much of it is missed because of the focus on the "hisorical Jesus." The need to toss aside the "supernatural" or the mythological because it was added later, or because it couldn't possibly have happened, misses the point, imo. The mythology of scripture, the primordial, archetypal truths are a treasure mine of insight just waiting to be explored, fleshed out and discussed. My $.02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wayfarer2k Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 For me, being progressive means that I hope to grow in my exeriences with God in life. It means that my understanding of God does not have to follow a pattern or a blueprint that someone else has had. There is freedom in finding my own way in faith. This doesn't mean that I discount the experiences and input of others. On the contrary, I can be open to their thoughts, ideas, and journeys and incorporate those parts that make sense into my own walk. Progressive means that I can hold firmly to my belief in God while being skeptical of all human interpretations of him/her, including my own. This means that I see myself as being in constant need of reform, in my thoughts, in my actions. In some areas, I am conservative. In others, I am liberal. In others, I am undecided. I am a work in progress. I'm not finished yet. And I want to view humanity the same way -- a work in progress that is not finished yet. This means that I long for transformation, of myself, of my beliefs, of my world. I have a hope for the reform of this world into a place of peace and justice. And I know that, at least in part, some of that depends on me. Progressive means that I value the past as a learning experience, but not as a goal. I am free to seek out a meaningful relationship with God in my own way without relying on a formula or a creed to define it. Yes, I am part of a larger whole. But that whole is diverse in its members and, perhaps, that is the way that it should be. I can be me while respecting and honoring others for their viewpoints and contributions. Progress, not status quo. Personally. Socially. Globally. wayfarer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystictrek Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 A progressive appreciates the following quote: "There are three truths: my truth, your truth and the truth.” -- Chinese Proverb I found that at "384 Peace Quotes" (quote #79) offered by the San Antonio Peace Center > http://www.salsa.net/peace/quotes.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius Posted April 23, 2006 Share Posted April 23, 2006 For me, being progressive means that I hope to grow in my exeriences with God in life. It means that my understanding of God does not have to follow a pattern or a blueprint that someone else has had. There is freedom in finding my own way in faith. This doesn't mean that I discount the experiences and input of others. On the contrary, I can be open to their thoughts, ideas, and journeys and incorporate those parts that make sense into my own walk. Progressive means that I can hold firmly to my belief in God while being skeptical of all human interpretations of him/her, including my own. This means that I see myself as being in constant need of reform, in my thoughts, in my actions. In some areas, I am conservative. In others, I am liberal. In others, I am undecided. I am a work in progress. I'm not finished yet. And I want to view humanity the same way -- a work in progress that is not finished yet. This means that I long for transformation, of myself, of my beliefs, of my world. I have a hope for the reform of this world into a place of peace and justice. And I know that, at least in part, some of that depends on me. Progressive means that I value the past as a learning experience, but not as a goal. I am free to seek out a meaningful relationship with God in my own way without relying on a formula or a creed to define it. Yes, I am part of a larger whole. But that whole is diverse in its members and, perhaps, that is the way that it should be. I can be me while respecting and honoring others for their viewpoints and contributions. Progress, not status quo. Personally. Socially. Globally. wayfarer <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius Posted April 23, 2006 Share Posted April 23, 2006 For me, being progressive means that I hope to grow in my exeriences with God in life. It means that my understanding of God does not have to follow a pattern or a blueprint that someone else has had. There is freedom in finding my own way in faith. This doesn't mean that I discount the experiences and input of others. On the contrary, I can be open to their thoughts, ideas, and journeys and incorporate those parts that make sense into my own walk. Progressive means that I can hold firmly to my belief in God while being skeptical of all human interpretations of him/her, including my own. This means that I see myself as being in constant need of reform, in my thoughts, in my actions. In some areas, I am conservative. In others, I am liberal. In others, I am undecided. I am a work in progress. I'm not finished yet. And I want to view humanity the same way -- a work in progress that is not finished yet. This means that I long for transformation, of myself, of my beliefs, of my world. I have a hope for the reform of this world into a place of peace and justice. And I know that, at least in part, some of that depends on me. Progressive means that I value the past as a learning experience, but not as a goal. I am free to seek out a meaningful relationship with God in my own way without relying on a formula or a creed to define it. Yes, I am part of a larger whole. But that whole is diverse in its members and, perhaps, that is the way that it should be. I can be me while respecting and honoring others for their viewpoints and contributions. Progress, not status quo. Personally. Socially. Globally. wayfarer <{POST_SNAPBACK}> <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius Posted April 23, 2006 Share Posted April 23, 2006 For me, being progressive means that I hope to grow in my exeriences with God in life. It means that my understanding of God does not have to follow a pattern or a blueprint that someone else has had. There is freedom in finding my own way in faith. This doesn't mean that I discount the experiences and input of others. On the contrary, I can be open to their thoughts, ideas, and journeys and incorporate those parts that make sense into my own walk. Progressive means that I can hold firmly to my belief in God while being skeptical of all human interpretations of him/her, including my own. This means that I see myself as being in constant need of reform, in my thoughts, in my actions. In some areas, I am conservative. In others, I am liberal. In others, I am undecided. I am a work in progress. I'm not finished yet. And I want to view humanity the same way -- a work in progress that is not finished yet. This means that I long for transformation, of myself, of my beliefs, of my world. I have a hope for the reform of this world into a place of peace and justice. And I know that, at least in part, some of that depends on me. Progressive means that I value the past as a learning experience, but not as a goal. I am free to seek out a meaningful relationship with God in my own way without relying on a formula or a creed to define it. Yes, I am part of a larger whole. But that whole is diverse in its members and, perhaps, that is the way that it should be. I can be me while respecting and honoring others for their viewpoints and contributions. Progress, not status quo. Personally. Socially. Globally. wayfarer <{POST_SNAPBACK}> <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted April 24, 2006 Share Posted April 24, 2006 (edited) We really do need a practice forum, don't we? I recommend cutting and pasting after clicking "add reply" , instead of hitting "quote" or "reply." Edited April 24, 2006 by AletheiaRivers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flowperson Posted April 24, 2006 Share Posted April 24, 2006 Hmmmmm.... sometimes practice doesn't approach perfection. As someone once said here doing the same thing over, and over, and over, and over again without ever changing anything in a positive way is a good definition of insanity. About the only thing that really improves with practice is musical performance and the creation of graphic or written works of art. One could probably include trade skills in this also. Obsessive-compulsive human behavior patterns are not healthy if they do not yield positive results in the future. I believe that we were all made that way from the beginning. It's part of our basic design. Besides, wasn't Darius some sort of Persian leader-dude in the ancient days? flow.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wayfarer2k Posted April 24, 2006 Share Posted April 24, 2006 ...and why MY post? I NEVER say anything that bears repeating! wayfarer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted April 25, 2006 Share Posted April 25, 2006 (edited) Hmmmmm.... sometimes practice doesn't approach perfection. As someone once said here doing the same thing over, and over, and over, and over again without ever changing anything in a positive way is a good definition of insanity. About the only thing that really improves with practice is musical performance and the creation of graphic or written works of art. One could probably include trade skills in this also. Obsessive-compulsive human behavior patterns are not healthy if they do not yield positive results in the future. I believe that we were all made that way from the beginning. It's part of our basic design. Besides, wasn't Darius some sort of Persian leader-dude in the ancient days? flow.... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Flow, have I told you lately that you're a trip?! Edited April 25, 2006 by AletheiaRivers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flowperson Posted April 25, 2006 Share Posted April 25, 2006 AR You should add long and strange to modify your trip statement as it may pertain to me and my doings. I take it as a compliment,THANKS !! Flow.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted April 25, 2006 Share Posted April 25, 2006 AR You should add long and strange to modify your trip statement as it may pertain to me and my doings. I take it as a compliment,THANKS !! Flow.... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> It was intended as a compliment sir. And to modify my previous compliment ... "You are a long and strange trip flow!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatherman Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 (edited) "What being a Progressive Christian Means to Me" by Fatherman P-R-O-G-R-E-S-S-I-V-E P is for the Peace that ... (tee hee hee! ) Ok! OK! It means that I get to decide what I want to believe and on my own terms and in my own good time. If I want to weep and shout Amen at a Billy Graham sermon, I will! If I want watch Joel Osteen's message every week and accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior at the close of every broadcast, I can! If I want to attend a church that welcomes men that dress like women, women that dress like men, and pompous agnostic academics who would prefer to debate Christianity more than practice it, I WILL! If I want to be a pompous agnostic academic who would prefer to debate Christianity more than practice it, you bet I will! I'll pray in a lotus position, tip my hat to Buddha, use the same words and phrases as fundamentalists and mean the same thing but see it totally different. It means being Saved one day and being Lost the next and valuing both. Seriously, though. P is for the Peace. Edited May 16, 2006 by fatherman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 "What being a Progressive Christian Means to Me" by Fatherman <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I have missed you so much. Welcome back! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatherman Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 "What being a Progressive Christian Means to Me" by Fatherman <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I have missed you so much. Welcome back! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Don't encourage me. This site will turn into Fatherman's personal theological playground before you can say Panentheist! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 Don't encourage me. This site will turn into Fatherman's personal theological playground before you can say Panentheist! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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