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The Message Of The Cross?


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Are we to follow Jesus' example even unto the cross? I mean, when Jesus says to: "Pick up your cross, and follow me" What does he mean?


Is the cross really about personal salvation, or is there something more to the message?


There is a nature within each of us that has the potential for all that you might deplore in this world. The NT speaks of it as the 'carnal nature', or by implication as the old 'creature' since it references us in Christ as a 'new' creature. This nature is said to be " 'enmity' against God as it is not 'subject' to the laws of God and neither indeed can be" (Rom 8:7) 'enmity' = hostility - 'subject' = to be under obedience (Greek)

This nature leads naturally by nature unto 'death' which is separation. It is a cross we as humans all have to bear. It came because of choice which the majority of us have no remeberance of at this time. To return to our rightful estate 'heaven', completeness, peace and love (which are the things we really want but seek as separate from God's light in a world of our own creation of opposites). It is necessary to 'crucify' = extinguish or subdue that nature to reaslize our true estate and unity. The cross is symbolic only and any blood sacrifice thought to be necessary for our redemption/salvation is purely from the standpoint of the carnal nature itself which is error.



Are we all expected to do the same as Jesus did, and give ourselves for the future of mankind, or was that taken care of when Jesus was crucified?


I don't know?


We are not 'expected' to do anything. God has no expectations because expectations are founded in belief about and God is beyond such a concept. God 'know's that in the fulness of times all will return to source. (Eph 1:10) (References are just for those who might require such to my statements, my authority to make such statements is not derived from references)


I think it is irresponsible to put our burdens on Jesus, and let him suffer for our faults, when we should be taking responsibility for our own actions. (It's about principal)


I have a son, and if he was punished for something someone else did, I would be angry. Why is it ok for us to let another pay for our mistakes (sins) If only in mind? Why would God honor such a practice?

If anything, I think the cross 'may' represent what is expected of every man...to die in his/her sins, and give themselves for the lives of others.


In my view this is very insightful on your part. The significance of the cross of course could be better represented as what is required to step out of error rather than what is 'expected' as I have explained above.


By this, I mean, to do our part for generations to come. To set examples now, spread love, and work to make the world a better place for future generations. To give ourselves for the cause of anothers gain, which I think may have been what Jesus was actually trying to do. (To simply show us the way)


I do believe Jesus was sent by God, but only to show mankind the way to survive 'ourselves'. Not to take away our sins, but to die so we might understand that we (mankind) are responsible for ourselves, and each individual must die also.


He simply set an example to follow,


Excuse my pickiness.... But Jesus wasn't "actually trying to do" anything. He did it. He extinguished or subdued the flesh and suceeded in returning to the Father. His original teachings described the way he did this and it seems to me there remains a sufficient amount of his original teachings in the New Testament writings to point to that very way if one waits on God's spirit to quicken that which is true and dissolve that which is in error because of mans inability to understand and correctly relay the original teachings.


As for forgiveness...


I think true forgiveness is only obtained by forgiving oneself. We don't need another to do it for us, imo. Life after death? Who knows?


Yes, wonderful observation. It is also helpful to remember that forgiving another is a pre-requisite for forgiving oneself.



This is my view. As you can see, it greatly differs from typical Christianity, which is why I don't know if I could even be considered a Christian at all...even progressive.


Am I wrong for thinking this way? I'm curious to know the progressive stance on the subject of the cross...




Yes it differs from typical Christianity definitions. However you can consider yourself by whatever tag uou desire, whether Christian or Progressive Christian. In the end it makes no difference what you call yourself. You are God's regardless of your label. May your understanding and knowledge of God grow without limits of a label.


Love in Christ,


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