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The Deception of Evolution


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1 hour ago, Elen1107 said:

I don't really see the "done in a flash" thing as being a real part of reality. Even some of the apostles didn't seem to 'get it' well into Christ's ministry. Paul in his letters talks about people going through a transition and needing time to change and essentially put on a new way of thinking and believing. Though Paul is writing to Gentiles, there's no reason to believe that Jewish people didn't need some time to change and adjust also.

There's no reason why someone who was living in the Kingdom of God, couldn't be standing next to and talking to someone who was living and thinking in the kingdom of Caesar. The first person could be going home to a community where everyone was sharing (both the work and the goods) and everyone was being treated equally, while the second person was going home to a community where there was no or very little sharing of goods and work and no one or not many people were being treated as equal.

Today you could have one person living under the English Crown, talking to a person living under the American Presidency, and another who is in the Kingdom of  Heaven, all living and thinking with different priorities, ideas and values. How close these are to each other and where they might overlap is another question.

I've looked at some intentional communities, how close these each might come to a true kingdom of heaven is another question also.

Just because other kingdoms and governments of different types have marched on through time, doesn't mean that the kingdom of heaven isn't still there and still growing and existing, (though it might not get in the news or be reported in famous histories, it doesn't mean it isn't still there in some form or another).

Paul talked about "don't live in the world" (I take this as meaning don't live in worldly ideas and priorities), at the same time he said Christians could not avoid or not encounter the "world" entirely. I guess the thing was just not to get sucked or drawn into worldly thinking and behaviors.

I might be thinking of the end of days as meaning the end of an era, and the beginning of days as the beginning of an era, which to me is what happened in the days when Christ first came and walked upon this earth.

We do agree and personally i don't require the Bible to confirm such but if that is what some want then they can read my post from 2007 here on the true Gospel message as relates to the Kingdom of God.... I think you might find it interesting and perhaps much in line with your words.

 

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I'm amazed to see how this evolution deception is spreading throughout the churches today. Man in his quest to gain worldly knowledge is casting away the plain truth of God's Word and "thus saith the

God bless you, Piriripi.  I admire your faith and I am glad to know you.  I post on a phone so I rarely write long missives or cover more than a single point so feel free to follow up.     The

PaulS, I have read through a few of the posts on this thread and feel I get the gist of where this is going.  I generally support your explanations on this topic.  I have come from a prior fundamental

1 hour ago, Elen1107 said:

I don't really see the "done in a flash" thing as being a real part of reality. Even some of the apostles didn't seem to 'get it' well into Christ's ministry. Paul in his letters talks about people going through a transition and needing time to change and essentially put on a new way of thinking and believing. Though Paul is writing to Gentiles, there's no reason to believe that Jewish people didn't need some time to change and adjust also.

I don't either but I was talking and wondering about what Jesus expected. Our understanding might be that even Jews might need time to change but it appears that Jesus said simply "Repent & Prepare' because ready or not, prepared or not, God will establish his Kingdom and if you are not prepared NOW, you miss out.

1 hour ago, Elen1107 said:

I don't really see the "done in a flash" thing as being a real part of reality. Even some of the apostles didn't seem to 'get it' well into Christ's ministry. Paul in his letters talks about people going through a transition and needing time to change and essentially put on a new way of thinking and believing. Though Paul is writing to Gentiles, there's no reason to believe that Jewish people didn't need some time to change and adjust also.

Again, I agree but I simply don't see that in Jesus' expectation and preaching. Unless we're talking about a realized eschatology found in the gorpels (40 to 70 years after the execution of Jesus) Jesus seems to be announcing a coming/ future eschatology and arrival of the Kingdom that will come whether people are repentant to not, whether they are ready or not.

I accept a 'partial' realized eschatology or men and women 'living the Kingdom' now in a 'finite' human way...........I simply question that was Jesus' understanding. And to me this is simply a point of interest or curiosity: the reality is the Kingdom didn't come as announced, the insight changed and we, i.e. many of us, believe in a present, finite living of the Kingdom.

I am not looking to the NT to confirm what I believe (that ended decades ago), I am simply doing an analysis of what the Bible portrays as the historical Jesus' understanding. 

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25 minutes ago, JosephM said:

We do agree and personally i don't require the Bible to confirm such but if that is what some want then they can read my post from 2007 here on the true Gospel message as relates to the Kingdom of God.... I think you might find it interesting and perhaps much in line with your words.

 

I think that it's great that we are agreeing again 🙂 

I especially liked the following from your link/post. That is one wonderful and insightful translation:

 

Matthew 4:17

From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Repent (metanoeo) (in Greek) means to think differently for the (basileia) realm of (ouranos) by implication happiness or elevated state is (eggizo) made near or at hand.

 

I think I'll copy it to my hard drive just so I'll have it and remember it. 

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20 minutes ago, thormas said:

I don't either but I was talking and wondering about what Jesus expected. Our understanding might be that even Jews might need time to change but it appears that Jesus said simply "Repent & Prepare' because ready or not, prepared or not, God will establish his Kingdom and if you are not prepared NOW, you miss out.

 

Again, I agree but I simply don't see that in Jesus' expectation and preaching. Unless we're talking about a realized eschatology found in the gorpels (40 to 70 years after the execution of Jesus) Jesus seems to be announcing a coming/ future eschatology and arrival of the Kingdom that will come whether people are repentant to not, whether they are ready or not.

I accept a 'partial' realized eschatology or men and women 'living the Kingdom' now in a 'finite' human way...........I simply question that was Jesus' understanding. And to me this is simply a point of interest or curiosity: the reality is the Kingdom didn't come as announced, the insight changed and we, i.e. many of us, believe in a present, finite living of the Kingdom.

I am not looking to the NT to confirm what I believe (that ended decades ago), I am simply doing an analysis of what the Bible portrays as the historical Jesus' understanding. 

I'm confused by your reply. Your last post quotes the same paragraph written by me twice, with what seems like two different comments on it. Is that what you meant to have happened?

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13 hours ago, Elen1107 said:

I tend to think of "the end of times" or the in breaking of the Kingdom of Heaven as something that started with Jesus. It's the end of a kind of worldliness and worldly thinking or a worldly reality that is ending and new reality and way of looking at the world that was starting. It's not "the end of the world" but an end of a kind or worldly thinking and reality that is/was ending.

This may happen to different individuals and or communities at different times in history and or in our own lives.

People have been saying "it's the end of the world" and in our generation, for like forever. (I think that someone else has already mentioned this on this thread). Perhaps they are looking for the wrong sort of events to be happening.

Jesus is quoted as saying, "The Kingdom of Heaven is within you", "That the Kingdom of Heaven comes in a way that cannot be seen", and that, "The Kingdom of Heaven is scattered among you and people do not see it". This is a far different type of transformation, than the end of the world happening one day, and a whole entire new world arriving the next.

Read Isaiah 66.

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On 8/8/2020 at 7:51 PM, Burl said:

One of the principles of this site is that the bible is NOT to be interpreted literally or as history.

It really does not promote the literalist interpretation you express, so I’m a bit puzzled by that.

Okay, when you are so far let me know. 

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14 hours ago, Elen1107 said:

There's no reason why someone who was living in the Kingdom of God, couldn't be standing next to and talking to someone who was living and thinking in the kingdom of Caesar. The first person could be going home to a community where everyone was sharing (both the work and the goods) and everyone was being treated equally, while the second person was going home to a community where there was no or very little sharing of goods and work and no one or not many people were being treated as equal.

Today you could have one person living under the English Crown, talking to a person living under the American Presidency, and another who is in the Kingdom of  Heaven, all living and thinking with different priorities, ideas and values. How close these are to each other and where they might overlap is another question.

I've looked at some intentional communities, how close these each might come to a true kingdom of heaven is another question also.

Just because other kingdoms and governments of different types have marched on through time, doesn't mean that the kingdom of heaven isn't still there and still growing and existing, (though it might not get in the news or be reported in famous histories, it doesn't mean it isn't still there in some form or another).

Paul talked about "don't live in the world" (I take this as meaning don't live in worldly ideas and priorities), at the same time he said Christians could not avoid or not encounter the "world" entirely. I guess the thing was just not to get sucked or drawn into worldly thinking and behaviors.

Apologies, my response was to this part of your post

Again, I agree but I simply don't see that in Jesus' expectation and preaching. Unless we're talking about a realized eschatology found in the gorpels (40 to 70 years after the execution of Jesus) Jesus seems to be announcing a coming/ future eschatology and arrival of the Kingdom that will come whether people are repentant to not, whether they are ready or not.

I accept a 'partial' realized eschatology or men and women 'living the Kingdom' now in a 'finite' human way...........I simply question that was Jesus' understanding. And to me this is simply a point of interest or curiosity: the reality is the Kingdom didn't come as announced, the insight changed and we, i.e. many of us, believe in a present, finite living of the Kingdom.

I am not looking to the NT to confirm what I believe (that ended decades ago), I am simply doing an analysis of what the Bible portrays as the historical Jesus' understanding. 

 

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5 hours ago, Pipiripi said:

Okay, when you are so far let me know. 

I read your link Pipi and it says the Bible is not to be read as it is written but instead interpreted as metaphor and symbolism.  

It is also anonymous and provides no rationale for the interpretation.   It is sheer guesswork written by someone in hiding.

I’m puzzled as to why you posted this link.

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Okay, one thing more we are the FEW remnant people that holding completely to the Bible wors Biblical. So for a better understanding we are the people of Revelation 14:12 and 12:17. We are the FEW that can preached the Everlasting Gospel to the World. Do you know what the Everlasting Gospel is?

I want you to see if we say something that isn't Biblical. Do it just for curious. God bless you. 

If you have something sent it for me.     Thanks.

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3 minutes ago, Pipiripi said:

Okay, one thing more we are the FEW remnant people that holding completely to the Bible wors Biblical. So for a better understanding we are the people of Revelation 14:12 and 12:17. We are the FEW that can preached the Everlasting Gospel to the World.

Good luck with that effort................

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On 8/10/2020 at 3:06 AM, Pipiripi said:

Read Isaiah 66.

I don't really see how Isaiah 66 refutes anything I've said. Don't really see what it really has to do with what I said either.

I came across this video earlier today. Perhaps it might explain what people on this website mean by "Progressive Christianity". The video is put out by the same people and organization that host this website and this forum.

Thanks for reading and for watching the video

 

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On 8/10/2020 at 7:24 AM, thormas said:

Apologies, my response was to this part of your post

Again, I agree but I simply don't see that in Jesus' expectation and preaching. Unless we're talking about a realized eschatology found in the gorpels (40 to 70 years after the execution of Jesus) Jesus seems to be announcing a coming/ future eschatology and arrival of the Kingdom that will come whether people are repentant to not, whether they are ready or not.

I accept a 'partial' realized eschatology or men and women 'living the Kingdom' now in a 'finite' human way...........I simply question that was Jesus' understanding. And to me this is simply a point of interest or curiosity: the reality is the Kingdom didn't come as announced, the insight changed and we, i.e. many of us, believe in a present, finite living of the Kingdom.

I am not looking to the NT to confirm what I believe (that ended decades ago), I am simply doing an analysis of what the Bible portrays as the historical Jesus' understanding. 

 

I don't know if I can quite explain what I am thinking or my insight into things.

Jesus is eternal. He's an eternal human being, or a human being who became eternal. He is today living in the "Kingdom" of heaven. He also touches and reaches us, living here in this world.

Like wise, the more we are touched by him and his spirit, the more we understand him, the more we enter the "kingdom". The more our understanding changes and we really see which way is up and which way is down, the more we accept his insight  to become our true selves in Christ, the more we enter the "Kingdom".

The "kingdom" might be more in the realm of understanding, spirituality and insight than something we see outside of ourselves like buildings and governments and perhaps even church buildings, and worldly priorities and so forth. A simple person living in caring and kindness might be more in or "higher" in the kingdom of heaven, than the richest most money minded top dog leader as far as this outer "world" is concerned.

I think that we can enter the eternal kingdom as we live our lives here and today. It doesn't need to be a big ta-da here on earth, (though it can be a wonderful ta-da in one's own hearth and spiritual understanding of things).

In this sense the kingdom has been established, it is eternal, and people, all people can enter it. That everyone doesn't see it, well, maybe they are not looking for it or they need to be shown it a bit or something.

I don't know everything, but I hope some of this makes some sense anyways.

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1 minute ago, Elen1107 said:

I don't know if I can quite explain what I am thinking or my insight into things.

Jesus is eternal. He's an eternal human being, or a human being who became eternal. He is today living in the "Kingdom" of heaven. He also touches and reaches us, living here in this world.

Like wise, the more we are touched by him and his spirit, the more we understand him, the more we enter the "kingdom". The more our understanding changes and we really see which way is up and which way is down, the more we accept his insight  to become our true selves in Christ, the more we enter the "Kingdom".

The "kingdom" might be more in the realm of understanding, spirituality and insight than something we see outside of ourselves like buildings and governments and perhaps even church buildings, and worldly priorities and so forth. A simple person living in caring and kindness might be more in or "higher" in the kingdom of heaven, than the richest most money minded top dog leader as far as this outer "world" is concerned.

I think that we can enter the eternal kingdom as we live our lives here and today. It doesn't need to be a big ta-da here on earth, (though it can be a wonderful ta-da in one's own hearth and spiritual understanding of things).

In this sense the kingdom has been established, it is eternal, and people, all people can enter it. That everyone doesn't see it, well, maybe they are not looking for it or they need to be shown it a bit or something.

I don't know everything, but I hope some of this makes some sense anyways.

I truly get this stuff is not easy to express. 

I express it as living the Kingdom rather than 'in the Kingdom or entering the Kingdom.'  

Plus I express it as the Kingdom is being established by the response of men and women to God (the embodiment Love). 

You make sense.

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9 hours ago, Elen1107 said:

I don't really see how Isaiah 66 refutes anything I've said. Don't really see what it really has to do with what I said either.

I came across this video earlier today. Perhaps it might explain what people on this website mean by "Progressive Christianity". The video is put out by the same people and organization that host this website and this forum.

Thanks for reading and for watching the video

 

I understand now exactly what you are doing here now. He says  about following Jesus and practicing. Why then you don't keep the 10 Commandments and keeping the Sabbath day as a holy day. Not Sunday. And what I'm doing is progressive because I Follow only the Bible teaching. 

Progressive means obeying God's Laws and have the FAITH of Jesus. 

Jesus says in Matthew 5:17-18, "THINK NOT" or "DON'T THINK" Why are you still thinking that the laws is done away after Jesus death? Do this earth and heaven has PASSED away? Disobeying Jesus, call you that progressive?

God bless you all friends. 

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17 hours ago, Pipiripi said:

I understand now exactly what you are doing here now. He says  about following Jesus and practicing. Why then you don't keep the 10 Commandments and keeping the Sabbath day as a holy day. Not Sunday. And what I'm doing is progressive because I Follow only the Bible teaching. 

 

You still haven't told me which version of the 10 Commandments you are referring to.

Paul in one of his epistles/letters says that it doesn't matter which day people call God's day and make holy. What is important is that they devote that day to God.

 

17 hours ago, Pipiripi said:

Jesus says in Matthew 5:17-18, "THINK NOT" or "DON'T THINK" Why are you still thinking that the laws is done away after Jesus death? Do this earth and heaven has PASSED away? Disobeying Jesus, call you that progressive?

 

Jesus in many of his teachings enhanced the law and made them more perfect. For instance, the law says, "You shall not kill". Jesus does not negate this but goes on to say that one should not even get angry. The law says a man may divorce, Jesus says that people may only get divorced in extreme circumstances. There are many other examples of this.

The first commandment in the law is to have no other god before the One God. Jesus says to love God with all your mind and all your heart. These things are similar, but they are not the same. Jesus makes the second most important commandment to love one's good neighbor as oneself. This is not part of the 10  commandments. Still, Jesus says that all of the law is summed up in these two commandments.

How are people disobeying Jesus by doing and believing these things?

 

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On 8/13/2020 at 5:07 PM, Elen1107 said:

You still haven't told me which version of the 10 Commandments you are referring to.

Paul in one of his epistles/letters says that it doesn't matter which day people call God's day and make holy. What is important is that they devote that day to God.

 

Jesus in many of his teachings enhanced the law and made them more perfect. For instance, the law says, "You shall not kill". Jesus does not negate this but goes on to say that one should not even get angry. The law says a man may divorce, Jesus says that people may only get divorced in extreme circumstances. There are many other examples of this.

The first commandment in the law is to have no other god before the One God. Jesus says to love God with all your mind and all your heart. These things are similar, but they are not the same. Jesus makes the second most important commandment to love one's good neighbor as oneself. This is not part of the 10  commandments. Still, Jesus says that all of the law is summed up in these two commandments.

How are people disobeying Jesus by doing and believing these things?

 

The fourth Commandment, the seventh day Sabbath. Keep it Holy my friend 

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On 8/20/2020 at 3:59 AM, Pipiripi said:

The fourth Commandment, the seventh day Sabbath. Keep it Holy my friend 

Would you say that to all our nurses and doctors and firefighters? 

Those who risk their lives in order to save and protect the rest of us. Or would you just tell them, after all they give, that they are just going to hell?

Better to do what Paul said, everyone can choose which day they want to dedicate to God and spirituality.

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42 minutes ago, Elen1107 said:

Would you say that to all our nurses and doctors and firefighters? 

Those who risk their lives in order to save and protect the rest of us. Or would you just tell them, after all they give, that they are just going to hell?

Better to do what Paul said, everyone can choose which day they want to dedicate to God and spirituality.

Or perhaps the ideal is if one always lives that dedication and spirituality. 

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49 minutes ago, thormas said:

Or perhaps the ideal is if one always lives that dedication and spirituality. 

I totally agree with you

Though it is sometimes nice to have a full day of rest with NO work. Just to restore and rejuvenate.

Even God took a day to rest, . .  . sometimes I wonder what that feels like.  

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11 hours ago, Elen1107 said:

Would you say that to all our nurses and doctors and firefighters? 

Those who risk their lives in order to save and protect the rest of us. Or would you just tell them, after all they give, that they are just going to hell?

Better to do what Paul said, everyone can choose which day they want to dedicate to God and spirituality.

You don't understand the scriptures. Jesus have says, what to do on Sabbath. Or what can we do on the Sabbath day. Read Revelation 12:17 and 14:12. Are you saying that Paul didn't keep the Sabbath day?

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10 hours ago, Pipiripi said:

You don't understand the scriptures. Jesus have says, what to do on Sabbath. Or what can we do on the Sabbath day. Read Revelation 12:17 and 14:12. Are you saying that Paul didn't keep the Sabbath day?

It seems obvious that Jesus kept holy every day and particularly the Jewish hold day of Sabbath.

As for Revelation, I never indulge given that most people, particularly literalists, misunderstand it.

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11 hours ago, Pipiripi said:

You don't understand the scriptures. Jesus have says, what to do on Sabbath. Or what can we do on the Sabbath day. Read Revelation 12:17 and 14:12. Are you saying that Paul didn't keep the Sabbath day?

The essence of the Sabbath is to set aside one day to be grateful for all God does for us.  It is a day to turn the self off and focus on grace.

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On 8/23/2020 at 12:36 AM, Pipiripi said:

You don't understand the scriptures. Jesus have says, what to do on Sabbath. Or what can we do on the Sabbath day. Read Revelation 12:17 and 14:12. Are you saying that Paul didn't keep the Sabbath day?

Here are two verses from the Pauline letters about the Sabbath:, There might be more, I'm not sure.

 

Colossians 2:16

https://www.biblehub.com/colossians/2-16.htm

Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
 

Romans 14:5

https://www.biblehub.com/romans/14-5.htm

In the same way, some think one day is more holy than another day, while others think every day is alike. You should each be fully convinced that whichever day you choose is acceptable.
 

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On 8/24/2020 at 9:41 AM, Elen1107 said:

Here are two verses from the Pauline letters about the Sabbath:, There might be more, I'm not sure.

 

Colossians 2:16

https://www.biblehub.com/colossians/2-16.htm

Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.

If you see here you must see to which persons Paul is talking to. Read it completely the story and you will find out the truth. 
 

Romans 14:5

https://www.biblehub.com/romans/14-5.htm

In the same way, some think one day is more holy than another day, while others think every day is alike. You should each be fully convinced that whichever day you choose is acceptable.

This part has nothing to do with the Sabbath. You have six days only for you to do whatever you want. It doesn't matter which in this six days you make it Holy than the other days. But the Seventh day Sabbath is made for the Lord thy God. Keep it Holy. If you do your things on that day, then the promise from God on that day, you cannot get it. Blessed and Sanctified.

Do you have seen the truth. Revelation 12:17 and 14:12. Don't it means nothing to you my friend. Don't you know that the devil is after me because I keep God's Commandments and have the faith of Jesus? He doesn't need others that don't keep God's Commandments. Do you belong to God? Read Revelation 14:6-12.

 

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