JosephM Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 Vote in Poll and Comment if desired. Your vote is not public. (attached to your name) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephM Posted September 3, 2012 Author Share Posted September 3, 2012 Adding this post to keep thread recent so more can vote and we can get a better picture of where members stand in general in their choice of who should lead the next 4 years. So far it appears no one supports Mitt Romney. So far 5 have voted with one not registering any choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stanley Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 It will be interesting to see the results but I will be surprised if it trends any different than it is going right now. I almost always vote third party because I think the hyper-partisan politics will continue until both major parties start seeing people losing faith in them. Ross Perot did a great job with that and actually got the parties thinking (just a little bit). The party I was excited about was The Natural Law party that had Dr. John Hagelin was their presidential candidate. But they shut down in 2004. I felt a little guilty for having a protest vote when Gore lost to Bush by such a small margin. The third parties got us Bush for eight years. But I live in Texas, so there could never be enough third party votes siphoned from the Democrats to even give them a chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeW Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 I felt a little guilty for having a protest vote when Gore lost to Bush by such a small margin. The third parties got us Bush for eight years. But I live in Texas, so there could never be enough third party votes siphoned from the Democrats to even give them a chance. Stanley, Noam Chomsky said that he voted for Nader, but had he lived in a swing state instead of Massachusetts, he would have voted for Gore (i.e. against Bush). George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glintofpewter Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 There are significant issues but they will rarely replace the rhetoric. But I'm simple. I will not be voting for a Republican presidential candidate. In my life time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephM Posted September 4, 2012 Author Share Posted September 4, 2012 Stanley, I have always (UP TO NOW) pretty well voted third party candidates also even though not registered that way. I find it never appropriate for myself feeling guilty for voting my conscience. Even though others may say THAT I AM THROWING MY VOTE AWAY or causing a worse candidate to be elected. The truth to me is that they who say that, are usually throwing their vote away by voting not their conscience (if that is the case) but rather what they consider the 'best of 2 evils' making the election a self-fulfilling prophecy. This time i find one of the major candidates worthy of my vote. Perhaps it will be the first time a president gets elected that has my vote. Dutch, PS I'm with you Dutch, issues rarely replace rhetoric. Joseph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeW Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 Joseph, The problem with "voting my conscience" is we live in a real world with real world consequences of our vote (at least in certain states). To suggest that there was no difference between Bush and Gore, or today between Romney and Obama is, I think, false. Obama is not a socialist and Romney isn't a fascist, but there are significant difference between them - just ask undocumented immigrants, women, gays. Had Gore been elected, does anyone think we would have gone to war in Iraq? Would there have been massive tax cuts primarily benefiting the rich? If McCain had been elected would we be leaving Afghanistan? Would there be universal health care? Would gays in the military still not be telling? Would there have been any form of Wall-Street reform? George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephM Posted September 4, 2012 Author Share Posted September 4, 2012 (edited) George, I don't know what would have been. For the most part, i don't deal in hypothetical s which have to me no existence in reality. I certainly am not suggesting there was no difference between Bush and Gore..... only saying.... i vote who i think would make the best leader and hope others would do the same, even if it differs from my choice . In my view, many (not all) people i know who voted for Bush, threw away their vote and elected him when they thought a 3rd party candidate would be better but couldn't win, .....and now we live in the consequences. (IMO) If we all had a bit more faith that 3rd party candidates who we believe would make the better leader could actually be elected, and we followed through....it would happen..... but that also is hypothetical. Reality is..... we didn't and it didn't happen. I am at peace with reality. (That statement certainly does not mean that i will not take a part in continuing to influence and change things for the better... it only means i will do so... work toward change... from a place of peace without internal resistance to what is .) Joseph Edited September 4, 2012 by JosephM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayodeluz Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 I am registered with the Green Party in my home state of Connecticut. CT is not a swing state, so as of today I plan to vote for the GP candidate (Jill Stein). However, if CT were a swing state, then I'd vote differently (and like a poster said before, not for a republican). And that's the problem with the political system in the U.S. Except for rare instances nationally or at the local and state levels, third-party candidates really don't have a shot. The two-party system is entrenched to the point where you can't vote your conscious in many cases without risking a the worst option winning office. I have seen that Stein has really been out there on campaign trail, yet do you hear a word about her or other third-party candidates in the mainstream media? Not a word. I think that is how it will always be in the U.S. Here in Mexico, we just had a presidential election last July 1. There were four candidates, and all got equal coverage, all participated in the debates, all had about the same amount of TV ads, etc., even though one was on par with a U.S. third-party candidate in terms of chance. He garnered a whopping 2% of the vote in the general election. Yet, he and his party are even now running ads thanking people for the support he did have, and still trying to get the word out about what his party stands for (this is common here for all parties to do) and building it. The GP and other parties really need to do this as well, and make their voices heard. If they truly put forth the effort, then we'll see if they catch on with the U.S. public, which I don't think it will happen. Things will continue as usual with the republicans and democrats running the show, to the detriment of the country. As a friend of mine says, both the democrats and republicans will end up destroying the country, but the difference is that the republicans will do it faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adekis Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 (edited) I happen to agree about the two-party system being bad for America, but at the same time I'm of the group that reads Obama's speeches and finds myself agreeing with basically everything he says. I have no reason to vote against Obama since I don't disagree with his policies. If I did it would be a protest against the two-party system, which sadly would probably have little effect, and at least for this election would be a bit counterproductive, since I'm vastly in favor of the current President anyway. I wonder how it would be possible to avoid the two party system. Unless a third party candidate caught on like Roosevelt in the thirties, I don't see it going anywhere. The idea of the GP or other third parties spending more time and effort than ever before getting their word out doesn't seem like a bad idea, but I doubt it'd work. Hmm.... Edited September 6, 2012 by Adekis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 As a Canadian, I don't get to vote in American elections, but for my two cents, I hope and pray that Obama gets re-elected. I hate to think what will happen to the US if Romney gets in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelovek Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Please remember all politics are local. To effect change at the national level we must all support and elect those that are progressive in your community local elections. This requires knowing your candidates and not the proclivities of a particular party. This is the only hope to see a needed third party arise to give us a chance for the change promised by those currently 'in charge'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glintofpewter Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Welcome, chelovek. I am glad you joined the conversation after all this time. Dutch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulS Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 I guess one should never say never in politics, but in Australia it's being reported that the wheels have well and truly fallen off the Romney cart. Secret video recordings and internal infighting seem to be pretty harmful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeW Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 I guess one should never say never in politics, but in Australia it's being reported that the wheels have well and truly fallen off the Romney cart. Secret video recordings and internal infighting seem to be pretty harmful. Paul, I am not sure that the wheels have come off (yet), but the cart is wobbling badly. I think one of Romney's problems is he has no understanding of what ordinary people think or experience. So, he says these really stupid things without realizing how stupid they are. As one columnist said, these are the kind of things that wealthy people say to each other at their exclusive clubs and it becomes received wisdom. George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 Romney seems like he's from another planet - his wife, too. I don't mean to be rude; I mean they really, truly, don't seem totally human. It's like they're made of plastic or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stanley Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 Only 12 votes. I was hoping to see a broader view. In seems so far we can make a theory that PC votes are Democrats or independent, or we can make a theory that Romney supports don't participate in polls and that is why he is falling behind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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