Jesus As Savior

[des]

Hi,

I was wanting to respond to this particular post here.

 

>on social justice for all...but in your view, do you think that 'maybe" the point about Jesus being "The relm to God for US.." might be the key element 'difference' between Progressive verese liberal Christianity?

 

Well I would certainly buy this as the key element to Progressive Christianity.

But to separate it from liberal Christianity might be a little more difficult. Who would you say was a liberal (vs Progressive) Christian. And is a liberal Christian sometimes just another name for a progressive on?

 

>And you you think that between the far right''s exclusive view on Jesus as savior and everyone ELSE is unsaved....

 

Well you definitely captured the conservative or fundamentalist view all right.

 

>nd the far Liberal left of rejecting any sort of any sort of Savior figure even in the form of a Cosmic Christ.

 

As far as I know the only person to use the Cosmic Christ is Matt Fox (at least the term). I definitely just love the concept. Maybe you are talking about some UUs? Or people who see Jesus as a teacher, prophet, etc but not as in any way the Messiah. Is that describing a Jew?

I mean they may not really be part of a Jewish synagogue or consider themselves Jewish but that's the difference no? Btw, I think that that pretty much captured my views (which have evolved) a few years ago.

 

> Do you think this is the open balanced middle?

 

I'd definitely say it is balanced. But is it the true middle? There must be thousands of non-fundamentalists going to church or not going who don't think that non-Christians are going to hell. But who don't really have any specific thought as to what happens, who is saved. Maybe they feel that "good people" go to heaven regardless of faith and "bad people" go to hell. I think that's the middle really. For example, at least in this country, I don't think the average Catholic believes that all the "nonbelievers" (even good nonbelievers) go to hell.

What's that no.?

 

I don't know if Progressives are more liberal than liberals or are not as liberal as liberals, but I do think that liberal (or should we say blue states -- gosh I hate that!!!) is over used and almost meaningless (as is conservative these days).

 

Just my 2.3¢

 

--des

[BeachOfEden]

Des:

"Hi,I was wanting to respond to this particular post here.on social justice for all...but in your view, do you think that 'maybe" the point about Jesus being "The relm to God for US.." might be the key element 'difference' between Progressive verese liberal Christianity?"

 

"Well I would certainly buy this as the key element to Progressive Christianity.

But to separate it from liberal Christianity might be a little more difficult. Who would you say was a liberal (vs Progressive) Christian. And is a liberal Christian sometimes just another name for a progressive on?"

 

I believe from conversations I have heard from both Evangelicals on the far right AND liberals on the left..that yes, BOTH of the majorities DO believe that progressive IS just another or more appealing word for Liberal. Indeed..as far as social justice beliefs I think that Progs and Lib Christians pretty match see eye to eye..but theology speaking...there are a number of universalists mixed in with conditionalists in the networks of all Progressive Christians..but I don;t think that you'd find ANY conditionalist amoung Liberal Christian churches/groups..but instead only universalists...Also i think the vast majority's take on the discription of viewing "Christ as the relm to God," would be explained in pretty 'different' ways than those of Progs. I think that even Sponges statement that "Jesus is everyone's Savior..whether they know it or not" would not reside well with them because even though this view of salvation IS inclusive and open to all...Liberals seem to hold a deep mistrust of the mere concept or even the mention of the word "slavation," or "Savior." They seem to believe that when one views Jesus as "savior" in ANY form then he becomes a right wing-type ruler rather than a divine friend.

 

"As far as I know the only person to use the Cosmic Christ is Matt Fox (at least the term). I definitely just love the concept. Maybe you are talking about some UUs? Or people who see Jesus as a teacher, prophet, etc but not as in any way the Messiah. Is that describing a Jew?

I mean they may not really be part of a Jewish synagogue or consider themselves Jewish but that's the difference no? Btw, I think that that pretty much captured my views (which have evolved) a few years ago."

 

Christian UU's,yes but non Christian UU's even more so.

 

> Do you think this is the open balanced middle?

 

"I'd definitely say it is balanced. But is it the true middle? There must be thousands of non-fundamentalists going to church or not going who don't think that non-Christians are going to hell."

 

And THOSE ARE THE ONES whom we should reach out to, the ones I call Evangelicals Lites.

 

"For example, at least in this country, I don't think the average Catholic believes that all the "nonbelievers" (even good nonbelievers) go to hell. "

 

Well, it surely DOES help the the Vatican actaully did CHANGED their former fundamental view of hell towards a more moderate or progressive conditionalist-type view.

[soma]

We are all sitting on the beach and we all see the sun setting on the horrizon. Each one of us see a path of light coming across the water and each one is separate, but they all lead to the same sun. We say we are following Jesus and yes we still see different paths on the water. Let us learn, celebrate and help each other on our different paths to the same place.

There inevitably comes a time when evil, the devil and matter fail as an answer to life’s problems. I like to think of Jesus as the man and Christ as a consciousness that is leading me to the pure consciousness of the Father. People intuitively know that God is one and that we are all united in pure consciousness; therefore, no one is left out of heaven, and everyone possess the inherent ability to discover God. No one needs to remain in evil and darkness, if one desires to find light and live in pure consciousness. When everything is seen as God, then there is nothing evil that can oppose God or divine consciousness. The devil cannot squelch, repeal or conceal pure consciousness just like we cannot stop the sun from rising; nothing has the power to stop pure consciousness in the individual mind.

Make a Christian a better Christian, a Buddhist a better Buddhist, Muslim, Hindu, Tantric ect.

[pacigoth13]

Ok... I'm fine with the whole being a progressive who sees Jesus as Lord and Saviour. Jesus is God. Sure, we're sinners, redemption is found thru Jesus, that is heaven and the alternative is hell. We have to be reborn.

 

Fine.

Now, that being said, I interpret this existentially and not fundamentalist...