The Tao Te Ching

[JosephM]

I enjoyed all the comments and am in agreement. The only thing I have to express a bit differently is concerning...

 

What does it mean that hope is as hollow as fear?

Hope and fear are both phantoms

that arise from thinking of the self.

When we don't see the self as self,

what do we have to fear?

 

It seems to me that although hope is often enough to bring ones level of consciousness out of a fear based consciousness and is more supportative of life in this world than fear, hope also is empty or hollow. I say this because hope does not 'see' and remains a product of the thinking mind subject to its falsities. Whereas, faith goes beyond mind. (Hebrews 11 Faith is the SUBSTANCE of things hoped for, the EVIDENCE of things not yet physically seen) This faith goes beyond the thinking mind and 'sees' not a phantom of mind as does hope but rather the actual substance that is the very essence of things and leaves no room for fear or a remaining need for hope. It is of the Spirit rather than the flesh.

 

Just my take on the verses...

 

Joseph

 

 

[glintofpewter]

soma,

 

as always you create space for my soul

 

The empty space I like to refer to it as pure consciousness and see it as the medium that we live and communicate in. I see it as God's all-pervading consciousness that is in all things and people. In the awareness of God’s omnipresence I realize that God is all loving and always present so there is no need to fear either man or his developments because God has full power.

Ron Hogan's translation has clarity for me today:

Fear can keep you from getting the job done

but confidence can get you in over your head

Walk tall, but don't get cocky

 

Dutch

[soma]

Dutch thanks for the encouragement. It is so rewarding that we help each other on the spiritual paths that we are called too. We travel alone, but we are not lonely because we come closer to al-one, unity. We hold on to the middle,our center as long as we can before being thrust out into the world to reflect outward what we bring from within. Thanks again, you are a brother in Christ.

[JosephM]

Chapter 14 now open for comments....

 

Look, and it can't be seen.

Listen, and it can't be heard.

Reach, and it can't be grasped.

 

Above, it isn't bright.

Below, it isn't dark.

Seamless, unnamable,

it returns to the realm of nothing.

Form that includes all forms,

image without an image,

subtle, beyond all conception.

 

Approach it and there is no beginning;

follow it and there is no end.

You can't know it, but you can be it,

at ease in your own life.

Just realize where you come from:

this is the essence of wisdom.

[tariki]

I've taken a brief look at this thread and enjoyed some of the comments and the various ways the words of the Tao Te Ching summon up Christian parallels. I have always loved this scripture for its gentleness - its always seemed the polar opposite of many scriptures that to my ears seem to thunder their message to the point where you can no longer hear yourself think! (Perhaps thats the idea?) Anyway, we all seem to make our own associations.

 

Lately I've often been dipping into a book "Buddha and the Gospel of Buddhism" by Ananda K Coomaraswamy, written long ago in 1916. Coomaraswamy, though more Hindu than Buddhist, lends the Buddhist "gospel" a sympathetic ear and draws his own parallels with various other forms of mysticism and religion. He has a deep and broad heart. He says that the ultimate position of mystics of every age is that "if the truth is not to found in our everyday experience, it will not be found by searching elsewhere." Well, I was going to rabbit on a bit more, but I seem to have forgotten the link in my mind that this had with the Tao De Ching..........

 

Anyway, the words of this particular chapter suggest to me the words of the Christian mystic Meister Eckhart......."Nothing that knowledge can grasp or desire can want is God. When knowledge and desire end, there is darkness. And there God shines" And another, from his Sermon 19, "they do him wrong who take God just in one particular way. They take the way rather than God." It just seems to me that we (I?) am always reaching for something else, something distinct, something "other" as a way of "justification" instead of just resting in grace within the everyday whirl of life. We want a "way", some particular "knowledge", a fulfilling of some yet unfulfilled desire........yet all is already given, is already ours. In my own Pure Land "way" there were those who approached the call for a "sincere" mind towards the call of Amida by desperately seeking within themselves for signs of "sincerity", tormenting themselves at the slightest sign of doubt or insincerity! It was Shinran who taught that even the mind of sincerity was "given", not sought or earnt. It was "Amida's" mind in "ours", bestowed by grace.

 

Another of Eckharts phrases has come to mind that relates to this, at least in the rag bag of my own wayward mind! He is speaking of how we possess God, and suggests that this is found in the heart not in the mind......"not just in thinking about him always and in the same way........we should not content ourselves with a God of thoughts for, when the thoughts come to an end, so too shall God."

 

And so to the words of the Zen master, when asked just what his own miracles were...... "My miracles are these, when hungry I eat, when tired I sleep, when happy I laugh, when sad I cry"

 

(P.S. JosephM, please send me an email as I have lost your email address)

[rivanna]

Good to see you again, Tariki! your posts are always thought provoking.

 

Chapter 14 seems to me mostly a reiteration of the first one, on the mystery of the Tao being timeless and ineffable. We cant know it objectively or even name it, but we can participate in it. This could be a parallel to the psalms--Gods steadfast love endures forever--or Jesus saying Before Abraham was, I am etc.

 

I know what you mean about the gentleness of Lao Tsu as contrasted with some of the harsh language of the bible. And yet the Tao affirms a way of nature or equilibrium, while the bible affirms a way of mercy and compassion that transcends the natural order. The Tao seeks an abstract principle of permanence beyond change, while the bible reassures us of our human, personal relationship with God.

 

All the translations I looked at ended with the same idea, remember the ancient Way and apply it to the moment. But I like how Mitchell renders those lines with a more comforting tone: you can be at ease in your own life. Just realize where you come from. This is the essence of wisdom.

[JosephM]

To All,

 

To me, this chapter is about 'being', or Spirit in Christian terms. This is abstract and is undefinable by the senses. It is everything in the sense that all things impermanent come from it yet it is as nothing because it is unfathomable by that which does. We can approach it but it is without reference to time or location and you can't know it in the sense of thinking about it because the minute you do think about it, it is not to be found. But you can be in harmony with it which brings a peace beyond understanding.

 

Just my take to share on the chapter after some contemplation,

Joseph

 

PS Happy to have your participation here Tariki. I appreciate the way you tie much into the words of Meister Eckhart.

Karen - I like that rendering by Mitchell. I think it speaks to me more clearly.

[Mike]

As has been noted, some of this chapter reiterates the vagueness and mystery of the Tao, which we have already discussed quite a bit. So I will discuss what struck me particularly.

 

Form that includes all forms,

image without an image,

 

These two lines were very interesting to me. There are forms, there are images, and they each are images of the imageless; their true identity is nothing less than the Tao. This is what I get out of it, and it means to me that all things find their true identity in the Tao, yet the Tao is complete within and beyond these images. The Tao is the true Image/Form of all incomplete, partial images and forms, the true complete Self of all incomplete selves, if that makes sense to anyone else.

 

Colossians 1:15 comes to mind: ‘He is the image of the invisible God’

Approach it and there is no beginning;

follow it and there is no end.

 

This is powerful to me because it can have two meanings, at least in the language I read it.

‘Approach it’ can mean as one approaches a subject to study, or perhaps as one approaches a river to drink. The idea being one is on the outside, approaching and seeing that, “Yes indeed, I find no beginning and no end in sight.” But the next line says “you cannot know it [objectively], but you can be it.” So, if you can approach in such a way as to identify with it - ‘being’ it - then you have discovered firsthand no beginning (to yourself), and then you can also follow the Tao to no end. You are the Tao and the Tao is you, so you go on forever. Perhaps this is the meaning of the traditional idea of the ‘Taoist immortal.’ Zen asks us about our ‘original face.’ Who are we before our mother and father conceived us? It seeks to bring us out of our very limited conception of the ‘self’ and into transcendence, realizing that our true identity goes deeper and broader than what we normally call ‘me’. If you approach this greater identity, then there is no beginning, and in following, no end.

 

John 11:25 Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies;

 

Psalm 1:2-3 …his delight is in the law of the Lord, and on his law he meditates day and night. He is like a tree planted by streams of water, which yields its fruit in season and whose leaf does not wither.

 

As mentioned earlier, there are many scriptures which speak of ceasing to identify with the ‘old man’ and ‘putting on Christ’ - a new, deeper, and greater identity. Being ‘in Christ’ this way, is salvation.

[soma]

Look, and it can't be seen.

Listen, and it can't be heard.

Reach, and it can't be grasped.

 

...............

+

You can't know it, but you can be it,

at ease in your own life.

Just realize where you come from:

this is the essence of wisdom.

 

I agree what Joseph said about it being undefinable with the senses. We think we know the reality of matter and all things, but we cannot know reality as long as we are separated from it. Living in our skin, we look through eyes, periscopes, microscopes and telescopes, but our instruments and senses only let us perceive and understand what our minds allow us to perceive and understand. I feel the Tao is telling us that reality and the awesome material universe are something else altogether; Chapter 14 is telling us we need to change our paradigm in order to have access to Reality. In contrast to the external world outside of ourselves, the Tao is guiding us within ourselves where we find Reality. Reality is where integration is realized in the unity of our being with everything surrounding it, and it happens when we cease from identifying with our physical image. We can delight in our physical reflection, but I think the Tao is saying we should not think of it as ourselves. The emotions, thoughts, impulses and acts that flow into our bodies and minds only reveal our impermanence because our physical and mental streams are consistently changing and flowing with the chemical elements surrounding us as our bodies compose and decompose. Our bodies are not stationary because the atoms in it and the universe are constantly changing speed and existence, not allowing anything to appear as stable; yet, we see these things as permanent. This is the cause of all our problems, the Tao is advising us that the things we see are temporary, and the pure consciousness we cannot see is permanent.

[glintofpewter]

The last lines, as with others here, are key for me cause they speak to our actions and mindset as we live each day.

 

Probably tariki's quote

 

And so to the words of the Zen master, when asked just what his own miracles were...... "My miracles are these, when hungry I eat, when tired I sleep, when happy I laugh, when sad I cry"

 

would be an excellent paraphrase of the last lines.

 

Jesus's healing on the Sabbath is an excellent witness to this truth.

 

As the Tao points out

 

Reach, and it can't be grasped.

 

From Matt 12:10

When Jesus healed the man with the withered hand, a man who could not grasp, in the synagogue on the Sabbath, he brought down the curses of men who tried to grasp the holy through laws. Jesus might have said, "You cannot grasp the eternal God of Love with laws. Look at the people, here, now. Be with them when they laugh, be with them when they cry, be with them when they are hungry, respond to them with the grace of a lily. If you do this you will know the eternal God of Love."

 

 

I like Star's take on the last lines.

 

Know that which is beyond all beginnings and you will know everything here and now.

Know everything in the moment and you will know the Eternal Tao.

 

Dutch

[JosephM]

Chapter 15, Now open for comments.....

 

The ancient Masters were profound and subtle.

Their wisdom was unfathomable.

There is no way to describe it;

all we can describe is their appearance.

 

They were careful

as someone crossing an iced-over stream.

Alert as a warrior in enemy territory.

Courteous as a guest.

Fluid as melting ice.

Shapable as a block of wood.

Receptive as a valley.

Clear as a glass of water.

 

Do you have the patience to wait

till your mud settles and the water is clear?

Can you remain unmoving

till the right action arises by itself?

 

The Master doesn't seek fulfillment.

Not seeking, not expecting,

she is present, and can welcome all things.

[tariki]

I've been mulling over the new chapter and what seems to suggest itself to me is how misleading the words can be,words like "subtle", "profound" and "unfathomable". They seem to point towards a state of "enlightenment" far beyond my own capacity, a state of being impossible to attain within my current state of "mixed up confusion" (to use one of Bob Dylan's song titles!) It seems easy to me to miss the simplicity of the "master", how within her/his own being (or non-being!) there is no such subjective awareness of subtlety or profundity. Going to Eckhart again, he too has a short passage devoted to a description of the "realised" man, in his treatise titled "On the Noble Man". There he takes issue with those who teach that the man of God's true blessedness is in knowing that he knows God.......or in Eckharts words...."the spirit knows itself also as knowing subject; that is, it knows that it sees and knows God" and that such knowledge is the "seed and flower of blessedness." As I say, Eckhart argues instead that true blessedness consists primarily in the fact that the soul "sees God in himself..........knowing nothing of knowledge nor of love nor of anything else at all."

 

Well, this all seems a little bit airy-fairy, maybe too subtle and profound!!!! It seems very difficult to capture the simplicity of Grace. Without seeking to push my Pure Land way upon anyone, I would like to quote a few words from a couple of poems written by a lady within the Pure Land tradition, which capture for me the simplicity/profundity of grace in the whirl and confusion of everyday life.......

 

This lady has lived for a number of years caring for her husband, who suffers from dementia. My own mother's last few years were blighted in this way, and I can emphasise deeply with every word.

 

Anger, resentment and frustrations

Explode like an erupting volcano.

 

Knowing that dementia has robbed my husband

Of his keen memory, his thinking capaciy,

Does not help.

 

Caring for him day after day,

Love, compassion and understanding

Disappear into thin air.

 

Sitting quietly,

facing the Buddha altar,

I mediate on my Reality.

 

My human frailties and limitations

Allow Unhindered Light and Eternal Life

To constantly illuminate and affirm my total being,

 

With palms together

I bow in gratitude.

 

Further on the lady describes the terrible reality that she knows and lives each passing hour.....

 

The blank forlorn look on his face

Sends a message of emptiness.

He does not know where he is,

Nor what is happening

To make me so upset.

 

And she questions whether she will ever reconcile herself to such a situation....

 

"With repeated practice

You'll get used to it,"

I hear a caregiver say.

The question for me is

Will I? Will I? Ever?

Be able to accept all this

In Suchness.

 

The poem ends....

 

He is standing beside the chair

Wearing the shirts and boxer shorts only,

Thinking he is properly dressed

To sit at the table to eat his meal.

 

He looks like a little boy.

His innocence is so revealing.

It warms my heart.

I smile and tell him

What he has forgotten to wear;

He looks at my face and chuckles

As a glimmer of awareness dawns.

 

Together, we put on his khaki trousers,

Embraced in the centreless circle

Of Boundless Life.

 

Its difficult to make the leap from the "subtlety" of the "master" to my own state, yet in some ways it can be done.

[JosephM]

Interesting Poem Tariki,

 

My Mom passed away of Alzheimer's this last year after 4 or 5 years of my helping with care giving during my 3-4 months of winter stay in Florida with her and other visits throughout the year. It was hardest on my step-father when in spite of his loving care she ignored him or acted sometimes that she didn't realize he was even her husband. It is truly a time of both conflict and great possible growth for the caregiver.

 

The verses that mostly speak to me of this chapter are ...

 

Do you have the patience to wait

till your mud settles and the water is clear?

Can you remain unmoving

till the right action arises by itself?

 

The Master doesn't seek fulfillment.

Not seeking, not expecting,

she is present, and can welcome all things.

 

In Christianity we are admonished to "wait upon the Lord" (Master)

When we accept what is with total trust in God with all our heart that there is indeed a divine harmony and balance in all things even when it doesn't appear that way to the eyes, the mud does settle in time and we glimpse of a deeper reality whereby our appropriate actions arise of themselves by grace without mental confusion or work on our part. In my experience, when these actions arise with this presence, there is nothing that seems unacceptable or needs to be opposed. To remain in that presence is the challenge but the paradox is that it requires no effort but rather waiting ('qawa' in Hebrew) which is a patient binding together in this case with the Lord facilitated by what I believe is the will to do so.

 

Just my take and related thoughts on a part of the chapter,

Joseph

[soma]

Thank you for relating the Tao to dementia as I with my brothers are caring for my parents who suffer from dementia at different stages.

 

I wait for the clarity and then the mud is kick up and I wait for the clarity. The clarity is there I need to stop kicking up the mud.

[tariki]

 

 

I wait for the clarity and then the mud is kick up and I wait for the clarity. The clarity is there I need to stop kicking up the mud.

 

soma, I remember once someone saying on another forum that the lotus flower, the Buddhist symbol of enlightenment, grows from out of the mud..........not from a pot of diamonds! Which is quite a good thing as most days I seem to be sinking in the quicksand.

[rivanna]

Thankfully I’ve never had to take care of a dying relative, but reading chapters like this one helped me alot during pregnancy. The theme of letting nature take its course seems central to the Tao. The image of the water gradually clearing is so memorable, and the description of the sage as calm and gentle but firm.

 

Remaining still until “the right action arises of itself” reminds me of Alan Watts’ saying that things happen by themselves, but no one does them-- “it isn't happening to anyone. There is simply no problem of life; it is completely purposeless play—exuberance which is its own end.” Must admit I feel closer to a more Christian or biblical attitude, but it does have a certain appeal at times.

[soma]

I remember once someone saying on another forum that the lotus flower, the Buddhist symbol of enlightenment, grows from out of the mud.....

 

Tariki, Thank you this is such a nice image, and inspirational.

 

Remaining still until “the right action arises of itself” reminds me of Alan Watts’ saying that things happen by themselves, but no one does them-- “it isn't happening to anyone.

 

rivanna I like to relate things back to the Bible also. In this case I think of Christ and his consciousness. He said, “Lord let thy will be done.” Let God's pure consciousness flow through my mind in the form of ideas, feelings and insights, and let the divine results appear. I will get out of the way, "Let thy will be done." This attitude is healthy and much more relaxing than my rushing about trying to force people, things and situations my way. God can only do for us what He can do through us, we our just a part of His divine plan. God’s intelligence will work out the details and work through us for our success, if we let Him. Witnessing, the eyes become cameras for Our Lord's grand play.

[glintofpewter]

tariki

Together, we put on his khaki trousers,

Embraced in the centreless circle

Of Boundless Life.

Wonderful poem and great final image.

 

soma

I wait for the clarity and then the mud is kicked up and I wait for the clarity. The clarity is that I need to stop kicking up the mud.

Is that why it is so hard to find my way?

 

 

In C. 15 I like the descriptions of actions - well maybe not actions but attitudes or modes of behavior - descriptions that are clear and not evanescent.

 

From Star's translation:

 

Deliberate, as if treading over the stones of a winter brook

Watchful, as if meeting danger on all sides

Reverent, as if receiving an honored guest

Selfless, like a melting block of ice

Pure, like an uncarved block of wood

 

 

Mitchell translated this last line

 

Shapable as a block of wood.

 

Perhaps because our concept of "pure" doesn't include the notion of "unlimited possibilities" (from Star's notes). In the Bible and in the west "pure" is often used in the sense of "Free from adulterants or impurities". Here it seems to mean that "anything is possible". Those who believe the story of Adam and Eve is about a fall down instead of a step up are always trying to get cleaned up again. But if we don't start out with muddy feet then we clearly have "unilimited possibilities."

 

Dutch

[JosephM]

Chapter 16 now open for comments ...........

 

Empty your mind of all thoughts.

Let your heart be at peace.

Watch the turmoil of beings,

but contemplate their return.

 

Each separate being in the universe

returns to the common source.

Returning to the source is serenity.

 

If you don't realize the source,

you stumble in confusion and sorrow.

When you realize where you come from,

you naturally become tolerant,

disinterested, amused,

kindhearted as a grandmother,

dignified as a king.

Immersed in the wonder of the Tao,

you can deal with whatever life brings you,

and when death comes, you are ready.

[Mike]

I consider the replies to the last chapter to have been very powerful and thought-provoking. There’s nothing I’m going to add to it all, just a thanks to all for sharing their insights and thoughts.

 

 

Chapter 16 now open for comments ...........

 

Empty your mind of all thoughts.

Let your heart be at peace.

Watch the turmoil of beings,

but contemplate their return.

 

Each separate being in the universe

returns to the common source.

Returning to the source is serenity.

 

If you don't realize the source,

you stumble in confusion and sorrow.

When you realize where you come from,

you naturally become tolerant,

disinterested, amused,

kindhearted as a grandmother,

dignified as a king.

Immersed in the wonder of the Tao,

you can deal with whatever life brings you,

and when death comes, you are ready.

 

We come to this chapter at a particularly relevant time for me. I’ve begun to understand, perhaps more clearly than before, just what identifying with the ‘Source’ can mean. A few days ago a sense washed over me that my true identity is - using the language of the Tao - indeed this ‘Source’ - that I’ve come from it, am it, and in death I'll go back to it. This sense lasted only an evening but it effected a better understanding, I think.

 

The idea of all things ‘returning’ to it I take to be metaphor - ‘coming’ and ‘going’ are temporal-spatial images for what is meant to be the true, real, or ultimate ontological status of all things, perhaps transcending notions of space and time. This ‘Source’ is the true identity, or simply, the Truth, of all things. However, this is literal truth to this as well, because we happen to be creatures who relate in a spatial-temporal way, and I find it helpful and truthful to consider 'where we came from.'

 

Now, if one does not see one’s ‘self’ in the Tao, in God, then one may be walking in confusion and sorrow - a case of mistaken identity. That person may take the circumstances of his life to have the ‘final say’ on the meaning of his life, having not taken into account the Absolute, but rather approaching his life and his particular circumstances as if they were absolute, existing unto themselves. There is a lack of insight into what is beyond, or what is deeper. The ‘Source,’ here, is the source of meaning, what has the ‘final say.’

 

Another chapter says ‘Love the world as your self.’ Jesus said ‘love your neighbor as your self.’ This is language of transcendence, of bringing something (and someone) more into your understanding of ‘self’ than simply your ego-center. In seeing that you and the Tao are the same self, you can identify with, or touch, the Source -- and when death comes, you will be ready. You will be ready to let go of this life as an actor finishes his role and moves on, his true identity never actually lost in the playing of his role.

 

I’m sure many scriptures could be presented which parallel with this chapter, but I’d like to quote fully a meditation by Thomas Merton - within the Christian tradition at least - which expresses what I get out of this chapter.

 

What is serious to me is often very trivial in the sight of God. What in God might appear to us as ‘play’ is perhaps what He Himself takes most seriously. At any rate the Lord plays and diverts Himself in the garden of His creation, and if we could let go of our obsession with what we think is the meaning of it all, we might be able to hear His call and follow Him in His mysterious, cosmic dance. When we are alone on a starlit night; when by chance we see the migrating birds in autumn descending on a grove of junipers to rest and eat; when we see children in a moment when they are really children; when we know love in our hearts; or when, like the Japanese poet Basho, we hear an old frog land in a quiet pond with a solitary splash — at such times the awakening, the turning inside out of all values, the ‘newness’, the emptiness and the purity of vision that make themselves evident, provide a glimpse of the cosmic dance.

[soma]

Each separate being in the universe

returns to the common source.

Returning to the source is serenity.

 

If you don't realize the source,

you stumble in confusion and sorrow.

When you realize where you come from,

you naturally become tolerant,

 

I like what Mike wrote on this chapter where he said, "Another chapter says ‘Love the world as your self.’ Jesus said ‘love your neighbor as your self.’ This is language of transcendence, of bringing something (and someone) more into your understanding of ‘self’ than simply your ego-center."

 

To add to this soul centered life beyond the ego-center, one sees himself or herself in other people's soul center so they naturally become more tolerant. The ego-center thinks they are the center of the universe and there is only one center thanks to our spatial conditioning. The soul centered person sees many centers linked in what science recognizes as connected in a sting theory.

[JosephM]

Empty your mind of all thoughts.

Let your heart be at peace.

Watch the turmoil of beings,

but contemplate their return.

 

Each separate being in the universe

returns to the common source.

Returning to the source is serenity.

 

 

In these verses seems to me to be hid a great mystery and is the source of great peace in its knowledge. To me, its counterpart in Christianity is....

 

Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: 10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in (Christ): Eph 1:9-10 (KJV)

 

In a sense, All things come from God and all things return to God. Not as though there is really anywhere to go or return to but for purposes of useful understandable written communication only.

 

Just my thought on the subject

Joseph

 

[glintofpewter]

A few days ago a sense washed over me that my true identity is - using the language of the Tao - indeed this ‘Source’ - that I’ve come from it, am it, and in death I'll go back to it.

 

Thanks, Mike for the clarity with which you've said this.

 

 

Just trying to find my story -

 

Before becoming God and I are one

Becoming I am with God

After becoming God and I are one

 

 

Dutch

[tariki]

My own mind does quite a bit of straying and returning - the current verse speaks of stumbling in confusion and sorrow. There is a small verse from Shinran's works that I often reflect upon and bring me inspiration, consolation and assurance......

 

 

My eyes being hindered by blind passions,

I cannot perceive the light that grasps me;

Yet the great compassion, without tiring,

Illumines me always.

 

 

It tells me that though I "let go", though I and my mind wander, I am nevertheless always held within the light of infinite compassion, or "the source", Reality-as-is.

[JosephM]

(snip)

It tells me that though I "let go", though I and my mind wander, I am nevertheless always held within the light of infinite compassion, or "the source", Reality-as-is.

 

Tariki,

 

Yes, I would agree. In my experience, one cannot actually in reality leave source. It is impossible. One can only be confused and unaware which is an illusion of mind. Perhaps, the leaving and returning is from a concept perspective only, which only contains a relative level of truth for the mind.

 

Joseph