drummercas Posted March 15, 2005 Share Posted March 15, 2005 Age: 32 Location: Portland, OR Work: Service Engineer (ID Printers, hospital and credit card embossers). YAWN! Family: Wife and two daughters (10 and 2). Actually, the kids comprise my zoo. Music: Neurosis, Owain Phyfe, Fugazi, Red Sparowes, James Brown, John Coltrane, The Boston Camerata, Justin Wilson/New Model Army, Public Enemy Books: The Lord of the Rings by Tolkien, Race Matters & Democracy Matters by Cornel West, God's Politics by Jim Wallis, The Bluest Eye by Toni Morrison, Much Ado About Nothing by Shakespeare, Walden by Thoreau, Homegrown Democrat by Garrison Keillor Loves: Cooking, brewing beer, baking artisan breads, writing, sign language...oh, and, lest I forget, playing drums. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earl Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Just joined up & thought I'd say hello. See a few names here from another forum I'd been hanging out in. Got 1 of each: wife, son, & grandkid. Worked in mental health for 25 years. Spiritually guess I'd say I'm a "Christo-buddhist"(?) Long practiced buddhism while maintaining a generally Christian belief system and am quite interested in interreligious or interspiritual practice and the universals of mysticism. Can't say I "enjoy" bad painting and tennis playing, but I do it. See ya, Earl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
des Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Hi Earl, Welcome to the group!! I see you live in Kansas, used to live there a long time ago (not that I would go back or anywhere else in the midwest, though two days ago we got big snow). The weather is nice virtually anyway. :-) Other than that, I see here a couple things I wanted to comment on. drummacas, I see you know sign language. Haven't used too much of that in years but I do know a smattering here and there. Any particular reason for your interest? Also Armadillo UCC, my Corgi has done some herding. We can't afford it anymore but it was lots of fun while it lasted. She has high instinct and natural ability. She had about 8 classes or so. Prob. couldn't afford the gas to get there right now. Anyway lots of fun to read up on everyone. I think we should have an off topic forum area. Though in one of my other groups that is the most contentious and nastiest group. However, I think we are better behaved. ;-) --des Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cunninglily Posted March 19, 2005 Share Posted March 19, 2005 hello everyone I am new to this forum and delighted to be here. I live in Lafayette Louisiana with my partner Michael, our Malumut Sam, and a goldfish named Boris. I will be 48 the first of May. I work part-time in a shop that targets the Wiccan/Pagan population and facilitate workshops on the Tarot, with an emphasis on using the tool for the development of self-awareness and intuition. I also *read* the cards for clients. I am currently interested in Pagan/Christian dialogue, and work, in my own small way, to build bridges between the two traditions. The books which have made the most impact in my own life in the last year would have to be "The Way of Wyrd" by Brian Bates, and Peter Kingsleys two books, "In the Dark Places of Wisdom" and "Reality". I am searching for new and improved ways to articulate my faith (which seems at times to require the learning of a whole new language) and I am most confident that I am in the right place here for doing just that. ~lily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irreverance Posted March 20, 2005 Share Posted March 20, 2005 CunningLily: In that case you might be interested in Gus DiZerega's Pagans and Christians. Admittedly, the way that he depicts Christianity is not my general conception, but it is a popular one. I too am very interested in Pagan-Christian dialogue. Thanks for the book titles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cunninglily Posted March 20, 2005 Share Posted March 20, 2005 CunningLily: In that case you might be interested in Gus DiZerega's Pagans and Christians. Admittedly, the way that he depicts Christianity is not my general conception, but it is a popular one. Yes, I own and have read Gus DiZerega's book, but it left me a little unsatisfied and probably for the same reason as you state: "the way he depicts Christianity is not my general conception". I do appreciate and respect the overall intent of the book though and think that he is largely successful in his attempts at "bridgemaking". I was just recently thinking, in fact, that I should read this book again. Thanks for the reminder. ~lily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irreverance Posted March 20, 2005 Share Posted March 20, 2005 Btw, it's interesting because in many respects the form of Christianity that DiZerega presents is basically what I was taught in seminary. What I would like to do some time is to get together a group of Neo-Pagans and Christians to do a face-to-face book study together. That should be a great book to get people together to say, "Well, that's not where I'm coming from as a Christian/Pagan. So, here's my slant on life...." Part of the fun would be people trying to articulate their unique perspective. Maybe a future endeavor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cunninglily Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 What I would like to do some time is to get together a group of Neo-Pagans and Christians to do a face-to-face book study together. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, me too. In fact, that was in the back of my mind when I purchased the book. I have been a member of a local pagan group for the last two years, more actively at first than now, but I have made a few good friendships there, and have always been openly rooted in Christianity. But don't misunderstand me...most are either hostile to Christianity and/or mocking of it and the general consensus is that Christians are the enemy. I am accepted in this group primarily because I take care to use neutral language whenever possible and I never preach (you'd be laughing if you knew me better because I ALWAYS preach) and am genuinely interested in Paganism. But I am quite sure that if I began to be more openly and vocally Christian that things would become strained. It's a pity too, because i think the two have much to teach the other. I've always maintained, and said openly, that we share a common adversary, we Pagans and Christians, and it is NOT a particular religious tradition. Walter Wink has given me a new way to articulate this enemy in "The Powers That Be" and a whole lot to think about besides.... Let me know if you get anything going... ~lily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynthia Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 I just read this on gratefulness.org: "As we approach the Equinox, with its equal blend of darkness and light, we renew our commitment to live in harmony with all of life." Is that part of the Pagan idea of the spring equinox? It struck me given the other discussion of dark/light, evil/God, cold/hot. thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cunninglily Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 I just read this on gratefulness.org: "As we approach the Equinox, with its equal blend of darkness and light, we renew our commitment to live in harmony with all of life." Is that part of the Pagan idea of the spring equinox? It struck me given the other discussion of dark/light, evil/God, cold/hot. thanks! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> At the time of the Vernal or Spring Equinox the day and the night are of equal length, so I assume this is what is meant by its "equal blend of darkness and light", but I have not personally encountered much emphasis on this fact in the local pagan rituals that I've witnessed. Most of the emphasis is on new life springing up from the *death* of Winter, planting, spring-cleaning or the clearing away of "dead weight" and the eternal life witnessed within the cycles of nature, ie, what "dies" in winter resurrects in spring and so forth. The Pagans refer to this holiday as Ostara or Oestre, named after a Slavic goddess from which our word Easter took its name. The Slavs were one of the last Pagan nations to convert to Christianity and held on to their traditions the longest. If you saw the recent movie "King Arthur", which is excellent btw, Arthurs Knights were Slavs who worshipped Rus (among others), who is a protector god and from which the name Russia has its roots. Arthur himself was a Pelagian Christian. The Slavic Pagans are interesting for their "double-faith" after conversion to Christianity, which means that they blended the "new" religion with their ancient pagan traditions. This is actually not uncommon in Pagan conversion...the "Witches" or "cunning-folk" of the British Isles were most often in church on Sundays. ...interesting eh? ~lily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynthia Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 Very interesting - thanks! I've some reading/listening (a la Teaching Co) re: different religions and find it fascinating. I have missed the Pagan belief system and had the obviously incorrect idea that it was no longer an active religion. I enjoy filling my excluvistic christian friends in on the Pagan origins of most of our holiday fun... I often see God most clearly in nature... may be good fit :> Oh boy, a new word for my self-defining list. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 (edited) Paganism is a umbrella term for many many religions and spiritual paths and is used in various ways depending on the person using the term. Fundamentalist Christianity sees Buddhism, Hinduism and Taoism as pagan because they are not Christian, but followers of those religions probably wouldn't appreciate being called pagan. Wicca is pagan. Asatru is pagan. Hermetics could be called pagan. Gnosticism is definitely influenced by paganism. As a practicing pagan, I never adopted the Celtic names for the solstice's or equinoxes. The terminology never resonated with me. Likewise, I didn't start my year at Samhain (Halloween) like many pagans do and I didn't feel inspired to celebrate the other esbats or sabbats either. I got turned off by the shallowness I perceived in much of "paganism" and yet, as someone who feels closest to God/dess in nature, I feel constantly pulled in that direction. I consider myself a Pagan Christian which is almost a contradiction in terms. Christian Nature Mystic doesn't sound quite so confused. LOL! Edited March 21, 2005 by AletheiaRivers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cunninglily Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 As a practicing pagan, I got turned off by the shallowness I perceived in much of "paganism" and yet, as someone who feels closest to God/dess in nature, I feel constantly pulled in that direction. I consider myself a Pagan Christian which is almost a contradiction in terms. Christian Nature Mystic doesn't sound quite so confused. LOL! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I never actually became a practicing pagan within any particular pagan tradition. I participated in a few rituals and discussion groups but essentially had a difficult time grokking the idea of "choosing" my own deities, and this comment is not meant derisively. I just never experienced the presence of the pagan gods, and the more paganism I studied or participated in the more Christian, it seemed, that I became...anything that actually rang a bell in paganism I had already essentially "tasted" in Christ, and the only pressing reason to choose to self-identify as both Pagan and Christian, as far as I can tell, is for the sake of fellowship and community with "like-minded" people, something increasingly difficult to find within established Christianity...at least where I live. But I empathize totally with the pull you feel and experience in and through Nature...I've "got it" pretty bad myself. I can remember years ago sitting outside in my yard with a few of my friends from church and while patting the ground with the palm of my hand, I said, "I feel Jesus right here...He's right here." and not one of them knew what I meant...and neither did I really...and still its more visceral or intuitive than thought. And yes, there are practicing "Christian Witches" and "Christo-Pagans" and "Celtic Christians" and so on and on...and though I flirted with these ideas, it seemed after all was said and done, that it just isn't necessary. We are both blessed and cursed in these days with the task of defining or re-defining Christianity, both for ourselves as individuals, and for the world in which we live. It is mindboggling to realize just how many different definitions of Christianity there are out there. So, for the sake of simplicity I am working to remain "just a plain ole christian" and to let the world know me by my fruits. This does not mean that I will not adopt religious rituals or practices that may raise an eyebrow or two "among the brethren"...it just means that I am a Christian as I observe these things, and nothing else. ~lily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted March 21, 2005 Share Posted March 21, 2005 I created a new thread to further discuss Buddhist Christianity, Taoist Christianity, Pagan Chrisitianity, etc etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest admin Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 I've been on this forum since before the new forum went up (since maybe 2001 or so?). It's too bad we lost all that good archive material. Beautiful and wise things have been written here. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Fatherman, do you mean the archive material from the old message boards? If so, I could probably find a way to recover that... Never thought about it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FredP Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Greetings All, By way of introduction... I am a 31-year-old married man (soon to be a daddy!) from the northwest suburbs of Chicago. My interests range from the sublime to the mundane: reading and writing on topics at the intersection of theology, philosophy, science, and spirituality; playing and (occasionally) writing music; computer programming; roaming the countryside with my wonderful wife Sue; group games; fine dining; shopping; progressive rock; and Chicago-style pizza. In my bizarre and twisted spiritual career, I have been variously Fundamentalist, Baptist, Charismatic, Episcopal, Unitarian, Catholic, Taoist, and thoroughly Agnostic! If I had to describe the most consistent feature of my journey, I think it would be that there is a kind of natural breathing rhythm to it: an "exhale" that propels me away from some aspect of Christianity as I currently understand it, followed by an "inhale" that takes in the new insights or information I learn and reintegrates it with the rest. Insofar as the "exhale" phases have pushed me away from a lot of safe places, e.g. belief in the literal-factual interpretation of the Bible (creation, fall, virgin birth, resurrection, etc.), I apparently stand squarely in the progressive camp. Yet, as the deeper meanings of all these realities continue to sink in more and more deeply, I find the "liberal" label every bit as inadequate as the "conservative" one -- both seem utterly unable to capture the momentousness of the Christian view of the world, or to give one any compelling reason to believe in it. I'm hoping to begin to develop this theme in some of my own personal writing (you know, in all my free time!). Hopefully you won't mind if I bounce some ideas off you as I go. Please drop me a message anytime! Fred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earl Posted March 24, 2005 Share Posted March 24, 2005 Greetings All, By way of introduction... I am a 31-year-old married man (soon to be a daddy!) from the northwest suburbs of Chicago. My interests range from the sublime to the mundane: reading and writing on topics at the intersection of theology, philosophy, science, and spirituality; playing and (occasionally) writing music; computer programming; roaming the countryside with my wonderful wife Sue; group games; fine dining; shopping; progressive rock; and Chicago-style pizza. In my bizarre and twisted spiritual career, I have been variously Fundamentalist, Baptist, Charismatic, Episcopal, Unitarian, Catholic, Taoist, and thoroughly Agnostic! If I had to describe the most consistent feature of my journey, I think it would be that there is a kind of natural breathing rhythm to it: an "exhale" that propels me away from some aspect of Christianity as I currently understand it, followed by an "inhale" that takes in the new insights or information I learn and reintegrates it with the rest. Insofar as the "exhale" phases have pushed me away from a lot of safe places, e.g. belief in the literal-factual interpretation of the Bible (creation, fall, virgin birth, resurrection, etc.), I apparently stand squarely in the progressive camp. Yet, as the deeper meanings of all these realities continue to sink in more and more deeply, I find the "liberal" label every bit as inadequate as the "conservative" one -- both seem utterly unable to capture the momentousness of the Christian view of the world, or to give one any compelling reason to believe in it. I'm hoping to begin to develop this theme in some of my own personal writing (you know, in all my free time!). Hopefully you won't mind if I bounce some ideas off you as I go. Please drop me a message anytime! Fred <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Wonderful to have you share your views here and would love to have you engage in an ongoing dialogue with us re them. Your use of the metaphor of "exhaling/inhaling" in reference to spiritual journey is interesting. triggered some associations on my part. Long thought of the mystery of Christ as a "koan" that seems to track with the koanic nature of how we see ourselves. Perhaps we see/interpret who/what Christ is in accord with view of self. As we contemplate Jesus/Christ, seems as if we, too, can pass through phases and levels of seeing in only literal or mythic or spiritual, etc. ways and it seems we pass through similar understandings of ourselves-literal (believing ourselves to be only concete "things") or spiritual-some ill-defined soul "substance" or somehow realizing all facets can be simultaneously true. To look koanically is in essence to "inhale/exhale-" we see a facet of something & go, "that's it" for awhile, then exhale & move on to another facet. In the broadest sense of "agnostic"-of "not knowing"-is another way of saying I'm open to constant discovery. Thanks for sharing, earl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
des Posted March 24, 2005 Share Posted March 24, 2005 Hi Fred, I used to live in Chicago, until I came here, which is New Mexico. Though I really lived in the city and also in Evanston. (BTW, if you aren't opposed to organized churches you might enjoy, if that would be the word, Wellington Ave. United Church of Christ. This is a sort of famous/ or infamous, however you want to look at it church in terms of social justice issues. Good folk too. Chicago pizza, got to say I miss it. I haven't had real pizza since I came out here. There is something they laughingly call pizza though. :-) However, if it's red or green chile is the question here. >By way of introduction... I am a 31-year-old married man (soon to be a daddy!) from the playing and (occasionally) writing music; computer programming; roaming the countryside with my wonderful wife Sue; group games; fine dining; shopping; progressive rock; and Chicago-style pizza. >In my bizarre and twisted spiritual career, I have been variously Fundamentalist, Baptist, Charismatic, Episcopal, Unitarian, Catholic, Taoist, and thoroughly Agnostic! Well sounds somewhat similar to a lot of our own journeys. I have never been fundamentalist, as my sister does that so well. :-) I was brought up in the Christian Science church though, which was an interesting experience. >progressive camp. Yet, as the deeper meanings of all these realities continue to sink in more and more deeply, I find the "liberal" label every bit as inadequate as the "conservative" one -- both seem utterly unable to capture the momentousness of the Christian view of the world, or to give one any compelling reason to believe in it. It's true. I think the term progressive might be better than liberal but any such term has inherent limitations. >Fred --des Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasn Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 hello i am 31, like the last person to introduce themselves - i am a minister in the methodist church - but i am not a methodist minister, the difference i guess is that most meth. ministers are appointed by the local conference but i was hired by the local church so the conference will not determine my length of stay or future move i grew up southern baptist and educated southern baptist but have been "drifting left" my whole life from some of the posts that i've peeked in on so far there are some interesting conversations going on here, I look forward to joining in on a few Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 Welcome Jasn, Wonderful to have you here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpirob Posted April 5, 2005 Share Posted April 5, 2005 Looking over all the members here I have noted that hardly anyone tells anything about their interest. So if you don;t mind me asking. What age group are you in? Anyone here ages 25 to 35? Anyone here from Southern Califoria? What are your interests. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hi BeachOfEden, Sorry for jumping on the bandwagon so late here, but I just joined recently. Most of the info you're asking for is in my profile, but for quick reference, I am a 30 yr old guy in northern NH! And no...it's not as cold as you think up here!! Although I'd like to say to my "fundi" friends in MA that the gates of hell are frozen shut in my neck of the woods! I see you like the beach, so something tells me I won't see you up here anytime soon! Anyway...another thing I love is meeting new people and chatting away....so feel free to drop me a line anytime! Peace, -Rob tpirob@yahoo.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ONMYWAY Posted April 25, 2005 Share Posted April 25, 2005 Well, as my user name indicates, I'm definitely 'On my way' meaning I give much more significance and credence to the search as opposed to certitude. I'm a progressive Catholic and a moderate-to-liberal Democrat. My age would put me at the older end of the boomers. I'm married with four grown children and eight grandchildren. My hobbies include reading; water color painting (just beginning); traveling, exploring parks and natural settings; classical, Celtic and New Age music; theater, symphony, good movies, and spending wonderful times with our grandchildren, socializing with family and friends. I've been reading through many posts on various topics and I feel I've found a place where I can come to just relax, chat and hang out with the rest of you. It seems this is a place where we can genuinely learn from each other and respect where we are all coming from. This is a time in our history where we as moderate, liberal and progressive Christians must come together to regain and reiterate exactly what Christianity is all about, and that is Loving God and loving our neighbors as ourselves. IMO, that becomes so obscured by so many things going on these days, as we almost helplessly watch while Christian Fundamentalists and ultra-conservative Catholics seem to have been so out there, particularly since the election of George Bush. Anyway, I'm looking forward to talking and connecting with all of you. I'm so impressed with the connections people seem to have been making with each other, and I believe it is so because of a common cause of returning Christianity to the authenticity and genuine teachings of Christ. ONMYWAY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AletheiaRivers Posted April 25, 2005 Share Posted April 25, 2005 <<<<< Waves as onmyway! Welcome to the board! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynthia Posted April 25, 2005 Share Posted April 25, 2005 Welcome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeachOfEden Posted April 25, 2005 Author Share Posted April 25, 2005 Welcome ONMYWAY. Glad to have a Progressive Catholic. They need a voice here as well! My hope is that we would have at least 1 Progressive Christian from each and every Judeo-Christian faith group..to counter the far right view. PS. We may have a Progressive Christian whi is XSBC joining us soon...that i met on MySoace..we'll see. BeachOfEden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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