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thormas

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Everything posted by thormas

  1. None that I know of but actually, when addressed to a beloved brother, is is kind of sweet.
  2. Don't worry, I can take it. You seem to miss that Jesus' focus on the Jews was one thing but as Ehrman shows his parables speak of pagans participating in the Kingdom. So if true, then he took it for granted that Gentiles would share the Kingdom. We have established he didn't preach to them because he came to announce the good news to the people of God. It might seem a stretch to you but that was the mission and he apparently took it seriously right to the end. *I get that you have issues with Paul of the NT (that he took Christianity in a way contrary to what Jesus prea
  3. All I did was report what Ehrman and the two prophets said. I didn't say anyone make it a definite conclusion. You miss my point: I recognize the other sayings - it is just that these saying adds something interesting to the mix and then the questions remain: did the end-time, in addition to an annihilation of pagan kingdoms, have instruction on the good news coming from the jews that (other) Gentiles sought/flocked to? If so, was it before or after the Kingdom was established? Seems you are reading into me, not me into Ehrman. 🙂
  4. What you say about scholars may be true, however, for years, I have taken my nod from Ehrman and sought out what he refers to as 'critical biblical scholars and historians.' There are points of disagreement but there is also a high degree of agreement. I now include about a dozen such scholars and it is growing. I have always been and still am more interested in theology that I am in biblical studies. However, I have, in part, you to thank for a growing interest in the latter: you have brought up topics, for example the Temple incident, that have sparked my interest and led me to do a good dea
  5. No one said inarguable, the point is that the scholars 'speculation' is more grounded than an amateur and that makes a difference - sometimes a considerable difference.
  6. Agreed but as we said that was not his focus, however he did speak of the gentiles (see Ehrman) in his parables being included. And a question for me is - was that interaction, especially in light of his teachings, an 'invitation' in itself?
  7. That is the question and neither Ehrman nor the quoted prophets make that a definitive conclusion. I have no problem recognizing the prophets on the end time including the overthrow of the kingdoms and I agree about the innocents. However, the question is do these innocents flock to the Jews for instruction about the good news before the Kingdom is established or after? If it is good news it seems that it would be before - just as Jesus announced the good news of the Kingdom before not after it was to be established.
  8. Concerning point #1 above, Ehrman, in his book 'The Triumph of Christianity' writes, "Throughout the prophets of Scripture can be found predictions that at the end of time God would bring outsiders into the fold of the people of God as gentiles flock to the good news that comes forth from his chosen ones, the message delivered through his Jewish people." And he quotes from Isiah2:2-3, "Many peoples shall come and say, 'Come let us go up to the mountains of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob, that he may teach us his ways, and that we may walk in his paths.' For out of Zion shall g
  9. That's the one: Ehrman, since he wrote it, says not only did Paul understand and take seriously the words of Israel's prophets but that those words meant the "word of salvation' (would extend) ...for all people." So Paul was in agreement on this with the prophets and Jesus. Ehrman also (as indicated in previous posts) shows that Jesus did indeed refer to and include 'non-Jews' (pagans) in some of his sayings and parables when talking about the Kingdom for all. Another issue is should any of the interactions of Jesus (listed by Elen) with non-Jews be considered as historical
  10. The trumpster's brother, Robert Trump. died this weekend. The trumpster describes his brother as also his best friend. He flys in and out to see him and leaves for his country club. Most people would stay till the end for a brother and a best friend or at least come back later or the next day. This is odd ............but we are dealing with a narcissistic sociopath - so he before everybody else. And we all are the worse for it.
  11. To 'trust in the Lord' does not mean that you have to walk on eggshells in discussions and I take your comments as both articulating your position and also trying to get across to another what you firmly believe and what you believe might be important for others. And it is fine that I disagree and do the same in discussions with you.
  12. We are all citizens of the same country, now in crisis, with no true leadership at the top. There is something 'bigger' than our own course as has been evident in times past when we pulled together and were encouraged to look beyond ourselves for a greater need, for a greater cause by real leaders.
  13. Actually, topless beaches are banned in many places and topless beaches are designated (or restricted) to certain locations. So too such statues.............that why god made museums 😀 put them in a museum and any can still 'study' them for history or artistic purposes. It still remains that they are the statues of a treasonous war against the US, in the name of salvery, that was defeated ........and is experienced as a painful reminder and acceptance (by some) of that cause. Time for them to go to a museum. We should have no problem 'suffering for others' whose need is great -
  14. Even with the separation of powers which we have always had: it's still called Leadership. If the trumpeter 'said' we should all do this, if he modeled it, if he got the Congress behind him as a show of solidarity and if got on the phone with Governors - we would have nearly if not complete nation wide compliance. Leadership .............however we are rudderless. If it impacts the entire nation, the nation needs to respond together............sadly the trumpeter only considers what impacts him.
  15. Well said on all counts. And for most people there is no dependency on books, simply a recognition, as you have said, that they convey the experience of other people - some long gone, some still with us and they are welcomed and respected insights of those people that are considered along with much else. There is no need to wait on God as God is ever-present.
  16. Elen, I know you got that from a book.............☺️
  17. OMG Burl - he pleads publicly with Russia to interfere in the 2016 election and our intelligence agencies say they interfered and the trumpeter comes out with the Putinator and says he disagrees strongly and he drops it. Really? And he totally ignores (and lies) about hearing/knowing about the bounty on our soldiers. Our soldiers. Really? There is more to that Biden story. Move past the conspiracy theory and do the research. Sure NK is doing just fine and we are no safer thanks to the trumpeter just trying to get credit without doing the long term work. Hey, how do you like the
  18. How would a person figure that out, figure anything out, learn or know anything without others be they found in a person or a person who speaks to us in a book, or song, or play, or movie, etc.? It seems we figure things out once we have something about which to reflect and wrestle with or fret about and then, sometimes, comes the Aha! moment.
  19. Not at all for Jesus is the epitome of the embodiment in Christianity but he is not the only incarnation of God.The Way is one yet there are many paths that share the Way. And no one has to talk about it: God is present in the words a mother uses to help her child to grow, that a stranger uses to care for another, that a friend uses when he speaks a hard truth to his friend, that a lover uses to console and care for her love, and on and on. It is God speaking in and through us that enables us to grow into our humanity (and thus our divinity). God need never be mentioned: God is ever-pres
  20. You do realize that the laugh face shows that I was joking with Elen, right? ____________________ Although it show be pointed out that it is a book that is telling us we need no one to teach us even as the book teaches that to us 😾
  21. Think I got it from you. Well if he said that there might not have been a book but there was a person and a word spoken - which once again goes to my point: not 'direct' from God but in and through others. _______________ As for God: in and through others is one and the same God. I simply think that given what direct means, it is theism revisited and speaks of a supernatural God bypassing the natural for a miraculous one-on-one with a person. Simply don't think that is how God works.
  22. More conspiracy theories and.... the trumpeter caves to Putin, alienates the Allies, blows it with North Korea and tries to muscle the Ukraine - really tells you something. Hey, accomplishments?
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