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Quaker Way

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  1. "It is my conviction that the root of all evil is the want of a living faith in a living God. It is a first-class human tragedy that peoples of the earth that claim to believe in the message of Jesus whom the describe as the Prince of Peace show little of that belief in actual practice." Mohandas Gandhi, 1936 I agree with the spirit of your post, Dave. It is the reduction of Jesus the teacher to Jesus the idol to be worshipped. This has turned Christianity into a cult following instead of a living faith based upon his teaching. Jesus as God is a human construction just like the Bible. If those who claim to be Christians followed the teachings of Jesus the teacher and mystic and leave out everything else, Christian hypocracy would be turned into Christian faith..
  2. Good Morning, Gunny... Thank you for posting! We have a few things in common. I'm ex-Navy and Vietnam combat veteran as well as being in recovery myself. Spent a lot of 24 hours in church basements! Whatever it takes to keep me sober just for today. Faith is a journey that unfolds before us over the course of a lifetime. I have deepend my faith as a Quaker by committing myself to understanding God through nonviolence as taught by Gandhi. There's a saying in The Rooms, "Let it begin with me." My Faith and Practice is certainly not mainstream, but my Faith is personal and not borrowed from established religions. I firmly believe that Faith begins Within and does not come from outside. Certainly we read, certainly we share ideas, and certainly we follow our own Leadings. Our Faith Within develops along with an Inner Life that is the Light of God within all of us. As we nurture our own Faith, as we journey the Path to God and our One True Home, we will know the windings, ups, and downs, storms, and clear skies along the Way. Be well along your Path and feel free to share your thoughts as you Journey! Peace to You
  3. I would stongly suggest 'Mohandas Gandhi Essential Writings'. Gandhi explains the spiritual connection between God and non-violence. In addition, he writes about his own development of a deep inner life and his career as an activist in the social struggles for human rights. The book is about $12.00 from Amazon and is short enough for group readings.
  4. Good Morning... I have found that my Faith is to be lived because, without doing so, I would simply be a hypocrite. My own Journey must include the practice of deep exploration of my motives and an understanding of the source of what I claim to be my convictions. For example, my dedication to peace and non-violence would be just a nice idea if I didn't understand that peace and non-violence are the Way of God. I therefore do not vote for politicians that support war and violence, reject any form of violence and war as entertainment, and support mass peaceful demonstrations and boycotts against the military, taxes used for war and violence instead of food, shelter, and medical care for those most in need. Cluttering my life up with wants, ambitions, opinions on things that just don't matter, and any persuit of more than what I need in my life just to live is a distraction from my persuit of living my Faith. Such things lead to what Quakers call an 'cumbered' life. I have also begun the habit of not explaining myself unless asked and view this post with an eye to my own motivation. This is a process that is a life-long unfolding for me, not an event. I would be content to live in a small cabin or in a one room apartment, but I don't think my wife would go for that.
  5. Religeous Society of Friends...a tradtional Quaker.
  6. Trees are part of my human conscience. No two are alike and their forms grow up from the ground filled with the Sprit of True Nature. I have hiked through forests and have camped surrounded by them. I have been protected from storms by them and have heard them making sounds in the night wind. There is something about trees...something that they know, something much deeper than we can guess at with all of our science and pretensive intelectualizing. Enya released a CD some years back called 'The Memory of Trees'...perhaps she suspects this too.
  7. When I was preparing myself for leaving the United Methodist Church and joining The Religious Society of Friends, I did extensive reading into Quaker history, faith, and practice. It really is true that organized denominations all have branches and the Quakers are no exception. The conservative branch of the Quakers incorporates structured services with clergy and, in my opinion, are more Baptist than Quaker. There is also an amount of homophobia associated with conservative Quakers and, again in my opinion, has nothing to do with the basic Quaker principle that the Light of God is within each and every one of us. That being said, I am a member of what is known as the 'liberal' branch of The Religious Society of Friends, the Friends General Conference, that continues the practice of silent worship and unqualified inclusion. As traditional Quakers, Friends embrace all people, oppose all war and violence, and follow the Quaker Testimonies of Peace, Integrity, Equality, Community and Simplicity. We have no clergy, no authoritative hierarchy, no dogmas, and no creeds. Feeling at home, I became a member over two years ago.
  8. Hello, Annalisa... One of the forces driving people away from church membership and the Christian faith in general is just what you said: holy rollers or, as I call them, 'Christian Extremists'. One denomination that doesn't see it's mission as one of converting the world 'from sin and the beliefs of Satan to the clear light of True Faith in our Lord and Savior Christ Jesus' is the United Methodist Church. They're kinda low key. I was a Methodist for years and one of several lay speakers in our church authorized to give sermons and conduct the service in the case the pastor was out sick or away on church business. I was also married in a Methodist church. Needless to say, it was hard for me to give up my membership but finally did after a year or so grappling with the issue of gay men or women prohibited from being ordained as ministers of the Church. I felt this was outside of the my belief that Jesus' mission was inclusive with no exceptions, asterisks, or fine print. My pastor asked me to reconsider so that members who felt the way that I did could argue for change from within, but I had to make a change. After attending Quaker meetings for sometime, I became a member of The Religious Society of Friends, a Christian based faith. If you are interested in the Methodist Church, it would be worthwhile looking into. The services are structured, but simple and kinda 'old fashioned' with a real 'down to earth' feel. I liked them myself and I have always had great pastors, too.
  9. Good Morning, ParSal... Thank you for your post. I believe that we, each and everyone of us, are on our own individual, personal Spiritual Journeys and that Wisdom is revealed to us as we go along. It is right and natural that we question, investigate, and struggle with ideas of the Unknown. Faith is not an event, but a process...one that entails our entire lives, both inner and outer. As we deepen through this process, we come to certain Leadings, a Quaker term for an intuitive drawing toward an understanding or the pursuit of glimpses into a deeper meaning. Follow those Leadings. I myself have often reflected on the idea of an Afterlife, but not in the usual sense of the word as in our ideas of 'Heaven'. Perhaps God is a spiritual destination, a Place that we are released into. Perhaps God is a state of Being that we become. Perhaps God is just the first of other Spiritual homes that we arrive at after our Spirit is released, an idea akin to those of the ancient Gnostics. It is not so much something that we need to identify and attempt to know in the concrete in this life, but something that we will experience on a Spiritual plane when our material life ends. By knowing that we, all of us living this very moment, are Children of God, each holding the Light of God Within, we can continue upon our Journey assured that our future Spiritual Selves will continue as part of that Journey. And as with any journey, we don't know what what lies around the corner. And we don't have to...It will be revealed to us in time. Be comforted by knowing that the Spirit of God is Within and that your own Journey will continue as it has all along.
  10. "And now you are no more your own but Mine; and I cannot be hid not separated from you: as you have had me your God in all your tribulations and sufferings wherever I did bear you and your griefs and all your afflictions in the yearning bowels of my tenderness; which yet I will break, I will break, I will break more infinitely open to you, which shall melt and dissolve you, and make you stream to me, as I am in flaming streams of love and life towards you; I will reach you in your Holes; Bolts nor bars of brass or iron, nor walls like mountains shall shut me from you; but in your Denns and Dungeons I will come in among you and walk in the midst of you and you shall know that I am the comforter of your Hearts and the Rejoycer and Gladdener of your spirits in all the times of your needs..." Edward Burrough, Quaker, 1673 Spoken to Friends while dying in Newgate Prison, London
  11. While at my Worship Meeting last Sunday, a Friend rose and spoke of beliefs and the spectrum of beliefs. This theme of understanding diversity brings many of us into a place where we struggle with human condition of wanting to be correct, wanting to be 'right', even if it means that someone else is 'wrong'. When People of Faith come to such a place in thought, it is helpful for us to look at ourselves and our motivations in relationship to our also being Children of God. What does God see? Children of God bickering like little children over something that isn't of any real importance. 'My religion is true and correct', says Billy. 'No! Only WE know the one true God!' shouts Mary. Old religion is of human origin and construction, stories and legends, moral fables and sayings of wisdom. They are a map but not the destination. When The Truth of God Within is clearly understood, the old religion and its creeds, hymns, sermons, morality speeches, political lobbying, and support for that which is not born of God's Love become irrelevant. The Truth is that we are of God and with God. We have, each and every one of us, the Light of God within us. We no longer need third-party managers of beliefs to broker God's Love, Mercy, Grace, and Forgiveness. God can be felt, seen, touched, and spoken with simply by looking inside ourselves and listening and feeling...not by arguing, lecturing, fighting, and shouting like schoolchildren in a playground. God is here and now...what Jesus meant by the Kingdom of God is at Hand. Here and now...with us and within us...forever and for all time.
  12. Here's a good website to look thought: http://www.quakerinfo.com/index.shtml And my favorite Quaker bookstore: http://www.quakerbooks.org/ There are a few different streams amongst Quakers that have histories based upon disagreements that resulted in splits. The two main groups are the Friends United Meeting and the Friends Geneneral Conference. The FUM have mostly 'programmed' meetings consisting of hymns, music, sermons, etc. and resemble Protestant services. The FGC consists of mostly 'unprogrammed' meetings of silent worship. Of course, affiliation with one or the other doesn't neccessarily indicate the type of worship...My Meeting is affiliated with both organizations and follows the silent worship tradition. So, go figure.
  13. My decision to sit with the Quakers was a hard one and it took a good year or so of introspection. I was a member of the United Methodist Church, but had social differences that I felt were in conflict with my own understandings. My pastor was very supportive and knew that I was searching for a place to Spiritually anchor myself. I finally decided the Quaker Faith & Practice mirrors my own most closely, and that's important for me. The silent worship of the Meetings that I attend is the safest and sanist part of my week. I get to clear my head and be with God, meditate, or just look out of the window at the trees outlined against the sky simply being at peace with myself. There are no distractions, no noises...just a group of Believers who come together every Sunday in order to sit and Believe together for awhile. I often leave Meeting feeling very peaceful, as if I have been reassured. I need that.
  14. The challenge to us as People of Faith is not to focus on differences, but to recognize similarities. Faith is not a subject in and of itself to be studied lest we lose sight of the very reason for our Faith. The Light of God Within is the same regardless of what you call yourself or what books you read. We can disagree over words and exchange quotes endlessly, but in the end it must be the Light of God Within that is our motivation in all things and not human constructions, interpretations, words, books, or any other form of second-hand experience with The One. God is within us, all of us, here and now. We need no books, no quotes, no third-party guides or interpretations from experts, no priests, bishops, ministers, hymns, or other such human symbols or representatives to speak to God for us and in our behalf. God is as close to each and every one of us as our own heartbeats and all we have to do is close our eyes, clear away the noise and clutter of our world, and reach out to The Source. God can be experienced by you, by me, by us. It is from that contact, the same contact that Jesus had with God Within, that is truely transformative and can change our lives. This simple Truth needs nothing more than itself.
  15. There is a Quaker saying...'Let your life speak'. The point is the difference between Faith and fashion. Marcus Borg put this so well when he wrote that Faith should transform. When we enter upon a Faith Journey, we also struggle with our old ways, we seek, we become discouraged, but all along we slowly shed the layers of our old understanding. This is a hard road to follow and is as individual as our fingerprints...it's different for each and every one of us. Faith is not something that we arrive at by sitting in a church pew and listening to someone else's words. Faith is a direct experience with the Unseen. Once we sense that God is not only without, but within as well, Deep seeks out Deep. We come to understand that God is as close to us as our own breath...and always has been...regardless of creeds, books, priests, churches, temples, hymns, etc. God is with us all, here and now. All we need to do is close our eyes and speak to the Light Within. This is where the Source of transformation lies. Dr. Rev. Howard Thurman expressed this Truth as being the 'Island of Peace within our souls'. It is there for all to find.
  16. Thank you for putting this so well, Soma. The Quaker mystic Rufus Jones points out that divisions among Christians centered around theological differences create contending partisans. The fact that we are all Children of the Light, all spiritual beings, all born with the Light of God Within, minimizes those differences. As Jones mentions elsewhere in his writings, religion flows from the inside out and not from the outside in. When we look inward to our Spiritual Selves and connect with that Source, we come to the Place of all religions.
  17. I feel October is almost there. Let's bring this idea around to a Quaker perspective for a moment. If we believe that God is an in-dwelling God, that God is within each and every one of us, then it is possible to know God directly. I believe it is not only emotions, but distractions and the clutter of everyday life...the competition for our time, thoughts, energies, etc. that keeps us from establishing a personal, deep relationship with our in-dwelling God. To center oneself, to stop and listen in silence, will bring us to within earshot of the 'still, small voice'. This is my biggest hurdle in Faith...to center and listen.
  18. For me, Spirituality is the awareness and seeking of God within us all.
  19. Do we need another denomination or do we need another reformation? I agree with Robert Funk in this article from the Westar Institute's publication, 'The Fourth R'. Here's the link: http://westarinstitute.org/Periodicals/4R_...unk_theses.html
  20. There are many different avenues to God and, too, there are many different interpretations of the life and teachings of Jesus. I personally relate to Jesus the Teacher. I believe that Jesus was a mystic with a great gift of God consciousness that enabled him to 'see' a clear path of life for those who would be Citizens in the Kingdom of God. Unfortunately, Jesus the person has been blurred by Divine status bequethed by humans thereby making our acquaintence with Jesus, the person, very difficult. For those wanting to look into another side of the understanding of Jesus, I recommend reading Jesus Seminar material first-hand. Here's the website: http://virtualreligion.net/forum/index.html You will find writings by the members of the Seminar here at the Westar Institute website: http://westarinstitute.org/index.html The ideas and writings of the Jesus Seminar members immediately made sense to me. Once I began to seperate out Jesus the Myth from Jesus the Person, I understood clearly how Jesus takes on different images and meanings depending on how Jesus is presented. I also pay close attention to the emphasis made on the teachings of Jesus versus the myths and stories of Jesus. There is good reason for people and churches not to focus on Jesus' teachings...they would break down the walls of the churches and expose the hypocracy of what passes for Christianity today. My sister-in-law sent me a very revolting email designed to whip up anti-Hispanic sentiment (taking over our country, do we want to live in a nation where English is no longer the official language, etc. etc.). It's really the same Nazi propaganda formula applied to the anti-everything right wingers. Imagine for a moment your doorbell rings while you're shuffling around in the kitchen one Saturday morning having coffee. You open the door and there's your neighbor Jesus stopping in to return the string trimmer that he borrowed. You both sit down at the table sharing a fresh pot of coffee, start talking about the upcoming NFL season, and then you begin complaining about how the Hispanics and illegal immigrants are having such a negative impact on the American way of life. What do you think he would say? I use this scenario to check my own attitude toward people and life and the world. Maybe someday Jesus and I can get together and have coffee on a Saturday morning...betcha he knows a thing or two. Russ
  21. My personal feeling on these points are... 1. The Bible is not a historical account, although it is based on past human events. I also do not believe the writings of the New Testament to be exact historical eye witness accounts either, but a combination of legend, historical events, personal experiences, and attempts to interpret the Divine in our human way. Although the writings of the Bible may be Divinely inspired, I do not believe they are Divinely written. The Bible is not only the legends, myths, traditions, and oral history of the Jewish people, it contains the same legends, myths, traditions, and oral history of the early Christian church. And there's nothing WRONG with that. I do object when the legends, myths, traditions, and oral history of the Christian church are portrayed as being Truth while the legends, myths, traditions, and oral history or other religions are portrayed as being false. All religions are human attempts at interpreting the Divine...Christianity included. 2. Faith is not the same as religion. Faith is based on a personal journey for and toward a Spiritual Truth and can also be augmented by personal experience. I have experienced both the Hand of God and Divine inspirations in my life. These transformative revalations define Faith for me and many others: Transformation. While myths and legends may help bring someone to a place further along the path of their Faith Journey, transformation is based upon a deeply personal experience that cannot be given, taken, or mediated in any way by another human. Religion is simply the best that we can do as humans in our attempts to interpret the Spiritual Truth. I continue to attend church BECAUSE I understand that it as a human expression in the form of song, ceremony, spoken word, communal worship, fellowship, community service, etc. I don't throw the baby out with the bathwater, but understand and make allowances for that human cultural expression. Religion can be a way TO Faith as a stop along a personal journey for people, but it certainly cannot be presented as the definition of such a journey. In an era of searching for such transformation, the fact that so many people have left denominational churches speaks for itself. Religion as presented by today's Christian churches just doesn't hold out much in the way of personal transformation. The Hand of God passed through my life when I was an atheist...it had nothing to do with the Christian church. 3. Who said that Jesus is coming? I don't accept the writings in the New Testament as being completely factual nor do I believe in the written predictions of the New Testament as being anything more than part of the legends, myths, traditions, and oral history of the Christian religion. And my personal Faith doesn't rely on TOTAL, unquestioning acceptance of the written stories that make up much of the New Testament, either. Having teachers and advisors along the journey can take the form of a one time casual conversation with a complete stranger and Wisdom can be found anywhere and in anything. 'When the student is ready, the teacher will appear.' This does not have to be just what is put forward as the canons of the Christian church by the Christian church. I, too, believe that we do not 'pick and chose' as you say, but come to believe in a God of our own personal understanding as God is revealed to us in our lives by God. This will not be the same for everyone and that transformative experience will not be the same for everyone. By having a human entity in the form of a religion, the Christian church and its canons, for example, define God for us leads us only to believe in a god that has human origins by definition. When we seek out God in our lives and try to establish a personal relationship with the inner Spirit that is within each and every one of us, then we will come to believe...not be required to believe. By the way, I really do have the perfect Spiritual sounding board...and so do you. I chose to call it God. After all, we are all Spiritual Beings having a human experience away from our One True Home.
  22. This is part of the original post that I responded to. Liberal-baiting and the propping up of dogma and proof texts isn't discussion, it's antagonism. I really have no patience for it myself on a website that aims at fostering dialogue among progressive Christians. To take this post seriously is to fall into the trap set by the author.
  23. "...wholesale revision of history and Sacred Scripture which is currently taking place under the guise of tolerance and political correctness." This is an interesting statement. I read most of the original post without raising an eyebrow because it continues a discussion that is well worn and, frankly, rather superficial and boring. Let's consider for a moment the above quote. This one part of a sentence provides more in terms of a personal statement than anything else in our Friend's post. Apparantly the author feels there is an iron-clad connection between his sacred scripture and history, in other words, the Bible IS history. But what Bible? What version? Written by who? Are we to believe the Bible was written by God and is not to be questioned? And exactly what 'history' is contained in the Bible that is not to be revised? Such statements are simply the repitition of official positions taken by various and sundry denominational churches who stand to loose their monopoly on their faith business. Hence the scary statements, the fist-pounding, the heretic-baiting, etc. Once people of Faith begin to question, investigate, look closer, debate, research, and formulate outside of and apart from the authority of the Vatican, the pulpit, the corporate mega-church, the faith-o-tainment performance artists on Sunday morning TV, we begin to build a truely personal Faith. Doctrine and dogma are not the same as Faith. At the core of such nail-biting over 'historical revisionism' is fear. The Vatican and denominational/corporate mega-church authorities stand to loose their home-made magical connection with the Divine if we beging to view Paul as a human being who lived in a certain historical time and in a certain society and reflected the prejudices and social structure of his world and the society in which he lived. In other words, the 'Sacred Scriptures' are products of people living in societies in specific historical settings. All we need in order to have Faith is God...no Bible, no Vatican, no Church to give money to, no priests telling us what to believe in or how to live our lives. Just God. God keeps it simple...people make it complicated.
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