lpoulain

I have to confess that Tribulation, Rapture, Left Behind, PreMillenianism, etc. etc. are so far off my radar screen that I have no sense of there being a substantial following for this nonsense at all. (Who's naive? Me!?!) OTOH I realize that the book series is selling well. My best friend's wife belongs to an evangelical church, and she mentioned the book series in a conversation a couple of years ago. I think my "sensitivity to other people's feelings" meter was on the fritz and I said something dismissive, and she couldn't understand how I could consider myself Christian and not believe in Rapture. My response (sensitivity meter still somehow reading "0") was that I couldn't understand how someone could reconcile their life in the real world with such an irrational concept. Needless to say in the 15 or so times we've seen each other since, the topic has somehow never came up again. But in truth I do not understand how people with any kind of modern world view could hold such ideas as being true. But again I don't understand how people can believe that Satan is any kind of real being either. I know that lots and lots of people do, including some in my church community. I think that the huge gap between progressive Xtians and conservative evangelicals is an understanding of God as a Being that intervenes in the experienced world. I think the differing understandings of God make conversation difficult if not impossible. Lou

Greetings all, I am a progressive Christian. I am drawn to the writing and insights of Cupitt and Geering and I am what I term a "non-realist." Yet I find fulfillment in the common life of my church community. I like ritual and my Episcopal parish has good liturgy with wonderful music and excellent preaching (most of the time). I live and work in Sunnyvale CA, a suburb of San Jose. For those who don't know the geography of the state, we are 35 miles south of San Francisco. I have been married 32 years, and our two adult children have long been on their own. We've two grandchildren. I am a materials manager for a small medical manufacturing company. That means I am responsible for procurement of parts, management of the parts within the building and production process, and for shipping. I spent many years in religious education for my former R.Catholic parish, but I "hit a wall" with the Catholic church in 2001. I am looking forward to this forum, and hope we acheive critical mass with enough and varied voices to keep the discussion interesting. Great icon, by the way. Don't have a clue! Lou

Whew! Where did you get that?!? I agree with the comment about the danger of a "new fundimentalism" (the Jesus Seminar section). Lou

Dear Rizzen, Your post is thoughtful. I don't think this is the place to debate and work to change each other's minds, but I want to address one comment you made: Rizzen said: "So, this is where I stand. I believe that homosexuality is wrong. I firmly believe that people are not born gay, that being gay is not necessarily a choice, but that if we are gay, we believe it is wrong, and we take steps to return to a heterosexual lifestyle, God will place his mercy on us." All I want to say is that I hope you will test your thoughts against the experiences of others who are gay. I am a 55 year old heterosexual. I did not choose my orientation, it happened to me. I know that my sexual orientation is deep rooted and constitutive of who I am. So it seems I could say that "God made me this way." If I believe this about my own life experience, how do I apply it to the experience of others who are oriented toward their same sex? I have to say also that "God made them that way." At least for some gays they could no more "return to a heterosexual lifestyle" than I could turn to a gay lifestyle. It's not in them. I think there is a big theological issue here. One approach is to say "the Bible says..." and deny any reality that doesn't fit. Another approach is to ask "What is real?" and search for how the Bible shed light on that reality. I don't think that denial of the real is, in the end, a good thing. Just a couple of thoughts, Lou

I don't have a clue how to categorize myself! I am progressive, but I don't know what model fits me. I have over the past few years worked my way through all of Spong's, Borg's, Crossan's books, the Jesus Seminar stuff, etc. This reading guided me away from Roman Catholicism. I sought out a new community that better allowed me to be and express myself, but within the Christian and sacramental tradition. I landed on my feet in the Episcopal church two years ago. What I find compelling from all the reading I have done is the insight that from the earliest days, Christianity took the religion OF Jesus and turned it into a religion ABOUT Jesus. This is not a condemnation, but an observation of fact. I am most moved by the writings of Don Cupitt, most particularly TAKING LEAVE OF GOD. I believe that this whole enterprise (religion) is about what Jesus called the Kingdom of Heaven, or Kingdom of God. I see it as both a way of interpreting our experience and a way of living in the world by which we experience to a greater or lesser degree the mystery summed up in Jesus' enigmatic words "If you want to save your life you must lose it." Theologically I am non-realist. I worship on Sunday and look forward each week to Communion which I see as a Kingdom ritual. (I like the language in the new 8-points) I rejoiceed at the confirmation of Gene Robinson's election as bishop of New Hampshire because we are living through a sea-change in attitudes toward gays -- another step in the progressive march toward justice. (pun intended) If all of this fits one of the models of Progressive Christianity, I am surprised! Lou