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FireDragon76

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FireDragon76 last won the day on July 29

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About FireDragon76

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    500 years of posting stuff

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  1. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    I think that's just soft-peddaled judgmental, puritanical, and narrow attitudes. You may cloak your ethos in the language of love, but you'ld consign a great deal of humanism to the scrapheap just because it doesn't measure up to a medievalist religious vision of the world. I frankly don't care what most other Christians believe about sexual ethics. Most Christian sexual ethics is far too much about controlling other peoples naughty bits and falls far short of a real ethic of love that doesn't denigrate pleasure or the human body. Sexual repression is not healthy. Realistic teaching and instruction on sex is healthy.
  2. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    I don't believe all forms of sex work would necessarily involve degradation or exploitation. Have you heard of sexual surrogacy, for instance? You are making sweeping judgments on things I don't think you have much knowledge of. Prostitution is a concern for us. Officially, our church takes somewhat conservative stances on this issue in its social statements. However, ultimately the individual's moral agency on these matters is what counts. Our social statements are meant to be persuasive, not coercive. I believe you simply don't understand the Lutheran way of doing things, so I give up debating this with you. You seem to have a real problem with a non-legalistic approach to Christian ethics.
  3. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    This is a pastoral issue and it's ultimately up to the congregation. However, most of us would be reluctant to excommunicate or ostracize anyone merely because they don't live up to our ideals. We would primarily be concerned about exploitation more than issues of moral impurity. Prostitution is legal in Germany, BTW, an historically Lutheran country, so this may not be an academic issue there at all.
  4. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    Perhaps you did not read that essay by Pr. Ed Knudson, he made it clear that the Lutheran view of the individual conscience is not that it is autonomous, as in liberal accounts of ethics, but that it is in relationship with God and the Church. Still, moral agency does rest with the individual, that's how it works. We are all individually responsible as human beings before God for our lives. The principal way love is expressed in the Lutheran tradition is in our sacramentalism and our Eucharistic spirituality. This is how God shows love for us, by imparting to us grace through the power of the Word. We ought to love each other as a result, but our standing before God is not dependent on our ability to love in kind, nor will we be able to perfectly actualize God's love in this life.
  5. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    Divine Command Theory is like what conservative Muslims, Orthodox Jews, or conservative Reformed Christians think of morality. God just hands people a list of do's and don'ts and you'ld better conform to them. No consideration is given to the concrete circumstances of individuals. It's a kind of moral absolutism or fundamentalism.
  6. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    Lutherans aren't opposed to love. I think you have misunderstood what I am saying if that is what you have taken away from our conversation. Prostitution may not measure up to some peoples ideals but many people marry for more ignoble reasons than a prostitute has for selling her body. So really, who are we to judge?
  7. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    Even though I doubt this person is Lutheran (or even necessarily a Christian), I agree with him that Jesus is focusing ethics outside of divine command, and instead focusing on human-centered compassion. My church would be in agreement on this point. Moralism and legalism are insufficient as genuinely Christ-like ethics. Loving actions are grounded in our concrete relationships with finite others. http://zimmer.fresnostate.edu/~afiala/documents/FialaGoodSam.pdf
  8. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    Prostitution is selling sex for money. I was focusing on the prostitutes themselves, not the people that utilize their services. There are many reasons why someone would turn to prostitution and it seems to me overly judgmental to say these people are excluded from God's kingdom, in the same way that saying just because somebody is a man married to another man, they are excluded as well. I don't think that's the point of Jesus teaching, I think its abusive in fact and misses the humanistic emphasis on his ethic, which is that good ethics is determined within concrete human relationships with actual persons (the Levite and pharisees are on potentially good legal grounds, from a Jewish religious standpoint, to avoid the beaten man in the parable of the good Samaritan, to avoid becoming impure themselves, but Jesus condemns them anyways because of their lack of compassion).
  9. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    Jesus accepted people. Some Christians want to have hierarchies of sinners, or a certain invariant standard for who is and is not properly repentant, and that's just not how how my church generally does things.
  10. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    The sacrificial role has been fulfilled in Christ. When did Jesus actually preach against prostitution? He speaks about sexual morality only in the vaguest terms. And his preaching concerning divorce doesn't preclude it altogether as a realistic possibility. If Jesus Christ was concerned about moral purity, he would not have hanged out with tax collectors and prostitutes.
  11. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    I really don't see Jesus articulating an ethic based on moral purity. That was more what his opponents thought was important.
  12. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    I don't think Jesus expects us to live a sinless life and that isn't what we understand the Christian life as primarily being about: moral purity.
  13. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    Lutherans still practice private confession, though use is much lower today (as it is among Catholics as well). My pastor grew up in an LCMS church in rural New Jersey and people went to confession monthly. Luther considered it a sacrament, though modern Lutherans differ on whether it is still considered one (some scholastics said since there is no "matter" in the rite, it cannot be a sacrament). I believe the "go and sin no more" is often abused, especially by people that demand other people live according to their standards of biblical morality. It's often a way of having the Law be the last word. And, given our theology, it's a bit problematic to say "don't ever sin again" as an absolute requirement, because sin isn't just outward behaviors but permeates our being. I've always simply understood this as Jesus saying "stay out of trouble" to the woman that was caught.
  14. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    My understanding of the Christian tradition calls me to engage with those politically constructed logical frameworks for the purpose of sharing God's love with others. The best way to help others is to have them teach us how to help them. That means taking the actual lived-experience of gay people seriously, including their politics. That doesn't mean uncritical affirmation, but the "burden of proof" is not on historically marginalized people, that's for sure.
  15. FireDragon76

    Yoga and Meditation Increase Narcissism

    That's unfortunate about your friend but from a Lutheran POV that has more to do with not appreciating the sacramental nature of vocation and how God provides for us through creation. It has less to do with belief in miracles as God's acts within history. You should really read that article by Pr. Ed Knudson about George Tiller. Individual moral agency is crucial to our sense of ethics. As Dietrirch Bonhoeffer pointed out, there is really no such thing as a Christian or Lutheran ethics that is divorced from secular ethics. Our church's social statements are persuasive but they are not coercive, it's ultimately up to the individual in their relationship with God and their neighbor to judge matters of ethical importance. The Lutheran doctrine of divinization is similar to Orthodoxy's (though from an Augustinian theological framework) but it's not the one thing that we talk about, unlike the Orthodox Church that makes it the only paradigm for talking about salvation. The primary way we talk about salvation is in terms of justification and this is also the doctrine that shapes our particular approach to ethics as well.
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