[Neon Genesis]

When I was a fundamentalist Christian, I was always taught that PCs were just cherry picking lukewarm Christians who weren't serious about their faith and that Jesus preferred us to be either hot or cold, but Jesus wanted to spit PCs out of his mouth. Even after I deconverted and went through this phase where I hated all religion, I had thought fundamentalists were more serious than PCs and you should either be a non-Christian or a fundamentalist and PCs were just enablers of fundamentalists. But then I discovered Bishop Spong's works and I started to read more about just what did progressive Christians believe and think and now I think PCs are just as serious and devoted to their faith as any other Christian can be, but PCs just have different ideals of what it means to be devoted than fundamentalists do and are just as passionate in criticism of religious extremism as atheist critics can be. If you were ever a bible-believing Christian, what did you think a lukewarm Christian was then and what do you consider to be lukewarm as a PC now? Why do you think there is so much misunderstanding of PCs in society, even among secular critics, and what do you think can be done to change people's perceptions of PCs as either lacking seriousness or being enablers?

This post has been edited by Neon Genesis: 06 November 2009 - 05:28 PM

[Javelin]

Interesting hypothesis. I’m not really sure how to classify myself these days. I’ve stated that I don’t consider myself to be either a PC or a fundamentalist. I’ve chosen the moniker of “moderate” to describe my current theological position.

I don’t consider myself a fundamentalist because I no longer accept the premise that our modern day bibles are either inerrant or fully inspired. I do not accept the premise of biblical literalism either. I don’t have a problem accepting a practicing homosexual as a bro/sis in Christ if they profess to be believing Christians.

I continue to believe in God and the Deity of Christ. I believe in the atoning sacrifice of Christ. I remain confused about many aspects associated with grace, works, and obedience. If works don’t count for anything then why are they considered important? Fundamentalist consider works essential, which seems to me to be in conflict with their professed doctrinal positions on grace.

Like you, I don’t get the hot/cold/lukewarm thinking associated with fundamentalist beliefs either. If we are saved by faith, then how much faith is required? Scripture seems to imply that faith as of a mustard seed is sufficient. If that is so, then what role does work play in the big picture? Religion is filled with inconsistent teaching and contradictory beliefs.

I confess to being one very confused believer at this point in my life.

[Jeannot]

Neon Genesis, on 06 November 2009 - 06:26 PM, said:

When I was a fundamentalist Christian, I was always taught that PCs were just cherry picking lukewarm Christians who weren't serious about their faith and that Jesus preferred us to be either hot or cold, but Jesus wanted to spit PCs out of his mouth. Even after I deconverted and went through this phase where I hated all religion, I had thought fundamentalists were more serious than PCs and you should either be a non-Christian or a fundamentalist and PCs were just enablers of fundamentalists. But then I discovered Bishop Spong's works and I started to read more about just what did progressive Christians believe and think and now I think PCs are just as serious and devoted to their faith as any other Christian can be, but PCs just have different ideals of what it means to be devoted than fundamentalists do and are just as passionate in criticism of religious extremism as atheist critics can be. If you were ever a bible-believing Christian, what did you think a lukewarm Christian was then and what do you consider to be lukewarm as a PC now? Why do you think there is so much misunderstanding of PCs in society, even among secular critics, and what do you think can be done to change people's perceptions of PCs as either lacking seriousness or being enablers?

One step I would recommend is to read Neale Walsch's "Conversations with God."

--John Green

[AllInTheNameOfProgress]

Some fundamentalists are more hot about converting people, and I would be too, if I believed God would send people to hell for not confessing Jesus. Some fundamentalists are very lukewarm in their faith -- just knowing they are saved gives them license not to take life seriously. PCs can be hot or lukewarm, too. PCs who are "hot" take Jesus' mandate to actively love the disenfranchised seriously, and they are trying to follow Jesus' plan for losing their egos and becoming pure love.

All of us pick and choose what to believe -- even the "fundamentalists."

[Mike]

This is a good question. Growing up within a fundamentalist church I too am very familiar with the accusation of 'lukewarmness' toward liberal Christians. But to be honest I think 'lukewarm Christians' may be equally distributed among liberal and fundamentalist churches alike, because when I see a fundamentalist church I typically see a lot of cognitive dissonance, a lot of 'belief in believing', but genuine belief? It is not so common. I tend to think that one who truly feels that he has been commissioned to save his neighbors from eternal torments in hell is one who will quickly drive himself into a frenzy.
Now in liberal congregations, in my limited experience of them, I think you probably have the same amount of 'lukewarmness', the difference being that liberals tend not to 'believe in believing' and therefore feel no pressing need to try. Perhaps this is why liberal congregations in general can be often be viewed as stale, superfluous and ultimately pointless, having the formalities and structure of Christianity but not the content or purpose. And I'm sure many of them live up to that stereotype.
But I don't think 'lukewarmness' is intrinsic to either approach. As you say, liberal Christians can be and often are very passionate and serious about their faith and practice, just as serious as anyone can be. I think genuine passion is a rarity no matter where you look.

Peace to you,
Mike

This post has been edited by Mike: 09 November 2009 - 10:29 AM