[minsocal]

davidk, on Feb 18 2009, 10:53 AM, said:

From what I understand, anxiety is an abnormal perception of hopelessness, dominating uncertainty, a combination of doubt, agitation, and dread, all without any sufficient objective justification; and can result from apparently being confronted with nothingness.
I don't find anything positive about anxiety, other than to consider when it doesn't exist. I have found it is differentiated from fear, which is the response to genuine threat.

The real world does not constitute itself by what you understand. Nor does philosophy, theology, or psychology! Or, Christianity for that matter. "What you understand" is frequently wrong or outdated.

This post has been edited by minsocal: 18 February 2009 - 11:00 PM

[minsocal]

davidk, on Feb 18 2009, 10:53 AM, said:

From what I understand, anxiety is an abnormal perception of hopelessness, dominating uncertainty, a combination of doubt, agitation, and dread, all without any sufficient objective justification; and can result from apparently being confronted with nothingness.
I don't find anything positive about anxiety, other than to consider when it doesn't exist. I have found it is differentiated from fear, which is the response to genuine threat.

Take a course in psychology 101, then return to the discourse. Ummm ... a course in psychology 101 THAT IS CURRENT, like the last 10 years. NOT A BAD IDEA, REALLY ... if you WANT, DESIRE ... to KNOW what DOES HARM to OTHERS.

This post has been edited by minsocal: 18 February 2009 - 11:12 PM

[davidk]

minsocal, on Feb 18 2009, 10:51 PM, said:

I certainly hope we might be anxious about doing harm to others.

Well, if nothing else, you seemed to have found something Joseph and I seem to agree about.

Soma seemed to allude mental illness being a physical illness affecting the brains ability to perceive or comprehend properly, ie; requiring medicine to balance the brains chemical needs.

Did you stop taking your meds?

[soma]

Being anxious is not a mental illness. It can be a worried state. An anxious Christian is a argumentative Christian, an exacting Christian, a self centered Christian, an unpleasant, insensitive Christian, a inconsiderate Christian, a Christian with a sharp tongue or bitter spirit. An anxious Christian may be a hard worker and have status with a high place in the Church, but he or she is not like Christ. Although anxious Christians claim to represent Christianity, they rarely follow in Jesus example. They instead use the name of Christ "in vain" to promote their church. The ideas preached about intolerance come from anxiety. Jesus did not teach about intolerance or anxiety, but peace and love and would have opposed such narrow ideas.

[minsocal]

davidk, on Feb 19 2009, 02:43 PM, said:

Well, if nothing else, you seemed to have found something Joseph and I seem to agree about.

Soma seemed to allude mental illness being a physical illness affecting the brains ability to perceive or comprehend properly, ie; requiring medicine to balance the brains chemical needs.

Did you stop taking your meds?

Never have took meds in my lifetime. You? Vile comment.

This post has been edited by minsocal: 19 February 2009 - 06:24 PM

[davidk]

soma, on Feb 19 2009, 06:17 PM, said:

Being anxious is not a mental illness. It can be a worried state. An anxious Christian is a argumentative Christian, an exacting Christian, a self centered Christian, an unpleasant, insensitive Christian, a inconsiderate Christian, a Christian with a sharp tongue or bitter spirit. An anxious Christian may be a hard worker and have status with a high place in the Church, but he or she is not like Christ. Although anxious Christians claim to represent Christianity, they rarely follow in Jesus example. They instead use the name of Christ "in vain" to promote their church. The ideas preached about intolerance come from anxiety. Jesus did not teach about intolerance or anxiety, but peace and love and would have opposed such narrow ideas.

Soma,

Again we have areas of agreement and disagreement.

I think we could all be anxious at some level at one time or another. When healthy we can realize and avoid this abnormal, unjustified, perception of hopelessness, agitation, and dread, so we can know and respond appropriately to real threats. If anxiety persists it could reach the point where it could be considered a mental illness requiring some medication, ie; anxiety attacks, depression.

I will say this, Jesus did teach about anxiousness in Mat 6:25-34 for example; He taught love toward man and intolerence toward sin in the example from Jn 8:11.
---
minsocal, I thought is was common knowledge on these pages that when the smiley icon () was used, the associated comment was to be considered lightheartedly. If for whatever reason you took this as a "vile comment", I apologize. No offense was intended.

[minsocal]

davidk, on Feb 20 2009, 12:55 PM, said:

Soma,

Again we have areas of agreement and disagreement.

I think we could all be anxious at some level at one time or another. When healthy we can realize and avoid this abnormal, unjustified, perception of hopelessness, agitation, and dread, so we can know and respond appropriately to real threats. If anxiety persists it could reach the point where it could be considered a mental illness requiring some medication, ie; anxiety attacks, depression.

I will say this, Jesus did teach about anxiousness in Mat 6:25-34 for example; He taught love toward man and intolerence toward sin in the example from Jn 8:11.
---
minsocal, I thought is was common knowledge on these pages that when the smiley icon () was used, the associated comment was to be considered lightheartedly. If for whatever reason you took this as a "vile comment", I apologize. No offense was intended.

No davidk,

The smiley icon can be used for a variety of intentions. Just like emotions. The icons are called "emoticons" for a reason. The subject of this discussion is not "lighthearted".

minsocal

[davidk]

minsocal, on Feb 20 2009, 04:25 PM, said:

No davidk,

The smiley icon can be used for a variety of intentions. Just like emotions. The icons are called "emoticons" for a reason. The subject of this discussion is not "lighthearted".

minsocal

Harming others is a serious subject, so don't compromise it like the other threads you threaten with your inane squealing about at a little trifle, as if run through with some villian's rapier.

[minsocal]

davidk, on Feb 20 2009, 09:58 PM, said:

Harming others is a serious subject, so don't compromise it like the other threads you threaten with your inane squealing about at a little trifle, as if run through with some villian's rapier.

As I already said ...

[davidk]

On grammar: "As I already said ..." should be 'As I HAVE already said...'; and "Never have took meds in my lifetime." should be 'Never have I TAKEN meds in my lifetime.'
---
Anxiety is an abnormal perception and is not considered to be rational. It is only rational thought that can stimulate a recovery from the immobilizing effects of anxiety.
Of all the religions and philosphies, it is only Christianity that provides any sufficient objective justification for certain, hopeful, and rational avoidance of anxiety.

I certainly hope we might not be anxious about doing harm to others.

[minsocal]

davidk, on Feb 23 2009, 01:28 PM, said:

On grammar: "As I already said ..." should be 'As I HAVE already said...'; and "Never have took meds in my lifetime." should be 'Never have I TAKEN meds in my lifetime.'
---
Anxiety is an abnormal perception and is not considered to be rational. It is only rational thought that can stimulate a recovery from the immobilizing effects of anxiety.
Of all the religions and philosphies, it is only Christianity that provides any sufficient objective justification for certain, hopeful, and rational avoidance of anxiety.

I certainly hope we might not be anxious about doing harm to others.

The "have" is not considered necessary, especially on message boards. I could spend the words here, but I do have other things to do.

So, you are saying that moral anxiety is abnormal? Anxiety has an approach componet as well as an avoidant component. Old concept, really. Backed by research.

This post has been edited by minsocal: 23 February 2009 - 06:34 PM

[davidk]

Moral anxiety characterizes a situation where the justifiablility of ethical claims is uncertain.
This would be better defined as, not moral anxiety, but moral dilemma. Anxiety connotes a dominating uncertainty, extreme uneasiness, and dread.

Just being uncertain over justifiability does not meet the criteria of anxiety. Now if the justifiability of the claim creates a dominating uncertainty, fear, overwhelming apprehension, tremors, and a sense of helplessness, then, yes, you could call it moral anxiety.

[minsocal]

davidk, on Feb 23 2009, 06:26 PM, said:

Moral anxiety characterizes a situation where the justifiablility of ethical claims is uncertain.
This would be better defined as, not moral anxiety, but moral dilemma. Anxiety connotes a dominating uncertainty, extreme uneasiness, and dread.

Just being uncertain over justifiability does not meet the criteria of anxiety. Now if the justifiability of the claim creates a dominating uncertainty, fear, overwhelming apprehension, tremors, and a sense of helplessness, then, yes, you could call it moral anxiety.

Ever skydived from a plane at 10.000 feet? Look, if you want to set all definitions about everything, then that's your "thing". Go about it as you wish. Just be prepared for the fact that, well, not everbody sees the world the same way you do. Flail away. How long do you intend to flail without success?

This post has been edited by minsocal: 23 February 2009 - 10:03 PM

[minsocal]

I could have chosen several threads to say this, but my participation on this board is now ended.

[davidk]

Our loss. No hard feelings, I hope.

It has been long contended that definitions must be established prior to a discussion or debate or they would be uprofitable. My attempt to address terms, such as 'moral anxiety', has been as they are defined through whatever legitimate sources I may garner. I can only assume your attempts similar. To find someone with a different point of view, and a situation where you can't necessarily dictate all the rules, should be a welcome challenge to you status quo.

If I have defined something you have issue with, it would be generous of you to offer your source or a more explicit explanation of your understanding rather than just being argumentative as in your skydiving post. We would then be able to rationally discusse the topic. I harbor no disrespect for any thoughtful ideas you present. I may ask questions or even provide my own propositions.

Perhaps it would be best if you took a break from posting to consider where you had been most effective in the dialogue and reconsider your posts where you may have been- less than effective.

[minsocal]

davidk, on Feb 25 2009, 07:14 AM, said:

Our loss. No hard feelings, I hope.

It has been long contended that definitions must be established prior to a discussion or debate or they would be uprofitable. My attempt to address terms, such as 'moral anxiety', has been as they are defined through whatever legitimate sources I may garner. I can only assume your attempts similar. To find someone with a different point of view, and a situation where you can't necessarily dictate all the rules, should be a welcome challenge to you status quo.

If I have defined something you have issue with, it would be generous of you to offer your source or a more explicit explanation of your understanding rather than just being argumentative as in your skydiving post. We would then be able to rationally discusse the topic. I harbor no disrespect for any thoughtful ideas you present. I may ask questions or even provide my own propositions.

Perhaps it would be best if you took a break from posting to consider where you had been most effective in the dialogue and reconsider your posts where you may have been- less than effective.

davidk,

I will contiue to post as I see fit. I have made my last series of direct responses to your posts. All further posts will be directed at the general theme of the thread and not towards any of your views or responses.

myron

[davidk]

minsocal, on Feb 25 2009, 12:24 PM, said:

davidk,

I will contiue to post as I see fit. I have made my last series of direct responses to your posts. All further posts will be directed at the general theme of the thread and not towards any of your views or responses.

myron

I'm sure that would be more than acceptable to everyone.